City Wants Your Participation in Parks and Rec Master Plan Survey

It is with great irony that I opened an email on Saturday from Chair of the Open Space and Habitat Commission, Kemble Pope.

He writes:

Hi David, First of all, thanks for all of the time and effort that you put forth in maintaining the Davis Vanguard as an independent source of information and as a gathering place for interested Davisites.

Yes, flattery will probably get me to pay attention and at least consider helping you out.

As you are aware, the Parks & Rec Master Plan update is underway. A survey is available online that gives residents a first opportunity to voice their opinion on the future of parks, recreation, and natural habitat in our community. I was hoping that you could encourage your readers to take 6-8 minutes out of their busy day to complete this survey… there are plenty of opportunities to broaden the assumptions of the survey questions/choices by typing your personal responses as well.

http://www.city.davis.ca.us/pcs/masterplan/

FYI, the OS&H Commission will be meeting in joint session with Parks & Rec Commission in February to discuss matters of mutual interest.

Yes, and as Mr. Pope should be aware, I have been a strong opponent of using city funds in conducting another Parks and Rec Master Plan Survey, particularly when we had a large amount of unfinished projects from the previous survey. I am far from convinced that we need to do a survey to find out what people’s usage of parks resources is and how we can better serve their needs.

It’s not that I do not think these are important questions–but given limited resources, I do not believe this is the best use of $75,000.

Nevertheless, I give Mr. Pope space here for the very reason that he indeed asked. I want to encourage the city to start thinking outside of the box. The city did a survey back in the spring and discovered an amazing thing, while most people still received their information about the city of Davis from the Davis Enterprise, the percentage had dropped steeply from the previous survey. The internet had strongly increased as a source for information and news about the city. For the city, trying to get information out to the public, that means that they have to use non-traditional means.

I took the survey, it is a difficult survey to take in some ways unless you use the parks a lot, I’m not sure how helpful the feedback will be. It was interesting that in the end, it asked if people should be able to smoke in the parks and then if people should be able to drink in the parks.

The big thing I have noticed in the parks especially when I take my young nieces and nephews there is that we need to be able to keep the equipment in good maintenance. Other than that, I really do not have much to say about the parks, we seem to have a good amount of parks in the city, a good mix of large parks and small neighborhood parks. In any case, the city doesn’t ask the one question I wish they would, whether they should be spending $75,000 trying to figure out what the public’s needs are in terms of parks and rec.

Along the same lines, I note that the owner of Westlake Plaza is requesting a change:

“to the General Plan and zoning for the center to allow a remodel of the vacant 22,000 square foot supermarket space into new retail and office suites ranging from approximately 160 square feet up to 3,000 square feet. The owner of the center has signed a lease with a small food store to occupy 3,000 square feet at the front of the former grocery store space.”

So let me get this straight, the owner wants permission to take what is currently a very small grocery store space and reduce it down to 3,000 square feet for a small food store? And they already have signed a lease with a small food store? There is a Circle K less than three blocks away, what would be the difference between the “small food store” and the Circle K that is literally right down the street?

“The General Plan currently requires the center to have a grocery store/ supermarket. The new food store does not meet the 15,000 square foot requirement. With the requested amendments a grocery store would be allowed but not required at the shopping center.”

There are a few things I do not understand. First, why the city is not more supportive of continuing neighborhood grocery stores. Second, the owner of Westlake has allowed the quality of the building to degrade substantially over the past 10 years. They are finally doing some basic upgrades to the facilities. The city has a continued policy that rewards owners that allow their property to degrade.

Unfortunately there was a neighborhood meeting for this last week. Now this goes before the planning commission in January and before the city council in February.

I just think West Davis can do better than to take what was once a small but functional 22,000 foot grocery store and turn it into a 3,000 foot food store.

Then again, I am still dreaming of having a Trader Joe’s there as I think the proposed location in the University Mall would be a disaster in a lot of ways.

—Doug Paul Davis reporting

About The Author

David Greenwald is the founder, editor, and executive director of the Davis Vanguard. He founded the Vanguard in 2006. David Greenwald moved to Davis in 1996 to attend Graduate School at UC Davis in Political Science. He lives in South Davis with his wife Cecilia Escamilla Greenwald and three children.

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148 Comments

  1. davis republican

    Actually, the revised proposal for the Westlake Plaza is a 6,000 sq ft grocery store. The issue is that none of the larger markets were able to make the space profitable, and the owner of the center has been unable to get anyone else interested in moving into the space. The space has been empty for over a year. The owner decided to pursue 6,000 sq ft, rather than 3,000 sq ft, due to community concerns. Also, the owner is putting in about $1.5 million to renovate and upgrade the center.

    I think it’s far more important to have a thriving center with a small grocery store than it is to hold out for a larger grocery store and let the center become even more of a waste than it currently is.

  2. davis republican

    Actually, the revised proposal for the Westlake Plaza is a 6,000 sq ft grocery store. The issue is that none of the larger markets were able to make the space profitable, and the owner of the center has been unable to get anyone else interested in moving into the space. The space has been empty for over a year. The owner decided to pursue 6,000 sq ft, rather than 3,000 sq ft, due to community concerns. Also, the owner is putting in about $1.5 million to renovate and upgrade the center.

    I think it’s far more important to have a thriving center with a small grocery store than it is to hold out for a larger grocery store and let the center become even more of a waste than it currently is.

  3. davis republican

    Actually, the revised proposal for the Westlake Plaza is a 6,000 sq ft grocery store. The issue is that none of the larger markets were able to make the space profitable, and the owner of the center has been unable to get anyone else interested in moving into the space. The space has been empty for over a year. The owner decided to pursue 6,000 sq ft, rather than 3,000 sq ft, due to community concerns. Also, the owner is putting in about $1.5 million to renovate and upgrade the center.

    I think it’s far more important to have a thriving center with a small grocery store than it is to hold out for a larger grocery store and let the center become even more of a waste than it currently is.

  4. davis republican

    Actually, the revised proposal for the Westlake Plaza is a 6,000 sq ft grocery store. The issue is that none of the larger markets were able to make the space profitable, and the owner of the center has been unable to get anyone else interested in moving into the space. The space has been empty for over a year. The owner decided to pursue 6,000 sq ft, rather than 3,000 sq ft, due to community concerns. Also, the owner is putting in about $1.5 million to renovate and upgrade the center.

    I think it’s far more important to have a thriving center with a small grocery store than it is to hold out for a larger grocery store and let the center become even more of a waste than it currently is.

  5. Doug Paul Davis

    6000 is better than 3. However, 22,000 was a small grocery story, this is just over one quarter the size. So we’re talking more like a convenience store than a grocery store.

  6. Doug Paul Davis

    6000 is better than 3. However, 22,000 was a small grocery story, this is just over one quarter the size. So we’re talking more like a convenience store than a grocery store.

  7. Doug Paul Davis

    6000 is better than 3. However, 22,000 was a small grocery story, this is just over one quarter the size. So we’re talking more like a convenience store than a grocery store.

  8. Doug Paul Davis

    6000 is better than 3. However, 22,000 was a small grocery story, this is just over one quarter the size. So we’re talking more like a convenience store than a grocery store.

  9. Anonymous

    I’m glad they are putting in $1.5 million to renovate and upgrade, they needed to do that five years ago rather than letting the place go to hell. It’s not just the location that has driven away other vendors, it’s that the place was poorly run and maintained.

  10. Anonymous

    I’m glad they are putting in $1.5 million to renovate and upgrade, they needed to do that five years ago rather than letting the place go to hell. It’s not just the location that has driven away other vendors, it’s that the place was poorly run and maintained.

  11. Anonymous

    I’m glad they are putting in $1.5 million to renovate and upgrade, they needed to do that five years ago rather than letting the place go to hell. It’s not just the location that has driven away other vendors, it’s that the place was poorly run and maintained.

  12. Anonymous

    I’m glad they are putting in $1.5 million to renovate and upgrade, they needed to do that five years ago rather than letting the place go to hell. It’s not just the location that has driven away other vendors, it’s that the place was poorly run and maintained.

  13. not so easily fooled

    Davis Republican- No, it’s 3,000 SF, not 6,000. I have seen the plans. He does have plans (although currently no tenants) for some other “food service” places adjacent to the store, but the store, itself, would be 3,000 SF.

    The owner, Jim Barcewski, bought the strip mall knowing that the CUP requires a 15,000 SF grocery store. The grocery tenants have gone from mediocre (Ray’s) to pathetic (Food Fair). Who wants to shop at a grocery store that carries wilted produce?

    Mr. Barcewski says he has made an effort to find a grocery tenant, but it is unclear how serious he is about that. He insists on a rent of $1.50/SF. His local effort to find a tenant appears to consist of running a 1″ ad in the Enterprise.

    What Mr. Barcewski WANTS to do is to convert the space into offices (which are more profitable for him). He is asking to have the grocery store requirement eliminated from the CUP.

    If he had bought the center with an unrestricted CUP, that would be one thing. However, he bought it knowing of that condition. Now he wants to change the rules to benefit himself – to the detriment of the neighborhood.

    I am reminded of the man who bought a cat at a pet store. After a month, he wanted to return the cat. When asked why, he replied that the cat didn’t act like a dog.

    Mr. Barcewski may not like his cat….but that’s what he bought.

    It is clear to me that another grocery store of Food Fair quality would suffer the same fate. However, a somewhat downsized, high quality, specialty store might do very well.

    I don’t know what the “right” solution to the problem is, but I hope the eventual solution will provide some benefit to the community, as well as Mr. Barcewski. To simply allow him to change the rules to his maximum benefit without an associated community benefit would be literally “giving away the store.”

    West Davis does not need another convenience store. How many times has Circle K been robbed?

  14. not so easily fooled

    Davis Republican- No, it’s 3,000 SF, not 6,000. I have seen the plans. He does have plans (although currently no tenants) for some other “food service” places adjacent to the store, but the store, itself, would be 3,000 SF.

    The owner, Jim Barcewski, bought the strip mall knowing that the CUP requires a 15,000 SF grocery store. The grocery tenants have gone from mediocre (Ray’s) to pathetic (Food Fair). Who wants to shop at a grocery store that carries wilted produce?

    Mr. Barcewski says he has made an effort to find a grocery tenant, but it is unclear how serious he is about that. He insists on a rent of $1.50/SF. His local effort to find a tenant appears to consist of running a 1″ ad in the Enterprise.

    What Mr. Barcewski WANTS to do is to convert the space into offices (which are more profitable for him). He is asking to have the grocery store requirement eliminated from the CUP.

    If he had bought the center with an unrestricted CUP, that would be one thing. However, he bought it knowing of that condition. Now he wants to change the rules to benefit himself – to the detriment of the neighborhood.

    I am reminded of the man who bought a cat at a pet store. After a month, he wanted to return the cat. When asked why, he replied that the cat didn’t act like a dog.

    Mr. Barcewski may not like his cat….but that’s what he bought.

    It is clear to me that another grocery store of Food Fair quality would suffer the same fate. However, a somewhat downsized, high quality, specialty store might do very well.

    I don’t know what the “right” solution to the problem is, but I hope the eventual solution will provide some benefit to the community, as well as Mr. Barcewski. To simply allow him to change the rules to his maximum benefit without an associated community benefit would be literally “giving away the store.”

    West Davis does not need another convenience store. How many times has Circle K been robbed?

  15. not so easily fooled

    Davis Republican- No, it’s 3,000 SF, not 6,000. I have seen the plans. He does have plans (although currently no tenants) for some other “food service” places adjacent to the store, but the store, itself, would be 3,000 SF.

    The owner, Jim Barcewski, bought the strip mall knowing that the CUP requires a 15,000 SF grocery store. The grocery tenants have gone from mediocre (Ray’s) to pathetic (Food Fair). Who wants to shop at a grocery store that carries wilted produce?

    Mr. Barcewski says he has made an effort to find a grocery tenant, but it is unclear how serious he is about that. He insists on a rent of $1.50/SF. His local effort to find a tenant appears to consist of running a 1″ ad in the Enterprise.

    What Mr. Barcewski WANTS to do is to convert the space into offices (which are more profitable for him). He is asking to have the grocery store requirement eliminated from the CUP.

    If he had bought the center with an unrestricted CUP, that would be one thing. However, he bought it knowing of that condition. Now he wants to change the rules to benefit himself – to the detriment of the neighborhood.

    I am reminded of the man who bought a cat at a pet store. After a month, he wanted to return the cat. When asked why, he replied that the cat didn’t act like a dog.

    Mr. Barcewski may not like his cat….but that’s what he bought.

    It is clear to me that another grocery store of Food Fair quality would suffer the same fate. However, a somewhat downsized, high quality, specialty store might do very well.

    I don’t know what the “right” solution to the problem is, but I hope the eventual solution will provide some benefit to the community, as well as Mr. Barcewski. To simply allow him to change the rules to his maximum benefit without an associated community benefit would be literally “giving away the store.”

    West Davis does not need another convenience store. How many times has Circle K been robbed?

  16. not so easily fooled

    Davis Republican- No, it’s 3,000 SF, not 6,000. I have seen the plans. He does have plans (although currently no tenants) for some other “food service” places adjacent to the store, but the store, itself, would be 3,000 SF.

    The owner, Jim Barcewski, bought the strip mall knowing that the CUP requires a 15,000 SF grocery store. The grocery tenants have gone from mediocre (Ray’s) to pathetic (Food Fair). Who wants to shop at a grocery store that carries wilted produce?

    Mr. Barcewski says he has made an effort to find a grocery tenant, but it is unclear how serious he is about that. He insists on a rent of $1.50/SF. His local effort to find a tenant appears to consist of running a 1″ ad in the Enterprise.

    What Mr. Barcewski WANTS to do is to convert the space into offices (which are more profitable for him). He is asking to have the grocery store requirement eliminated from the CUP.

    If he had bought the center with an unrestricted CUP, that would be one thing. However, he bought it knowing of that condition. Now he wants to change the rules to benefit himself – to the detriment of the neighborhood.

    I am reminded of the man who bought a cat at a pet store. After a month, he wanted to return the cat. When asked why, he replied that the cat didn’t act like a dog.

    Mr. Barcewski may not like his cat….but that’s what he bought.

    It is clear to me that another grocery store of Food Fair quality would suffer the same fate. However, a somewhat downsized, high quality, specialty store might do very well.

    I don’t know what the “right” solution to the problem is, but I hope the eventual solution will provide some benefit to the community, as well as Mr. Barcewski. To simply allow him to change the rules to his maximum benefit without an associated community benefit would be literally “giving away the store.”

    West Davis does not need another convenience store. How many times has Circle K been robbed?

  17. davisite

    The Coop board was considering opening a West Davis second location at Westlake Plaza. This would be a great idea. Nugget has recognized that organic produce and products are the growing market for families and no longer just the province of students. West Davis families,current and future(NW quadrant is most likely next for some type of peripheral residential development)is on the other side of town from Nugget. West Davis residents would need to take the lead in demonstrating that they would be strong supporters of a Coop at Westlake as the Davis Coop doesn’t have the ability to take major speculative financial risks like the national corporate market chains.

  18. davisite

    The Coop board was considering opening a West Davis second location at Westlake Plaza. This would be a great idea. Nugget has recognized that organic produce and products are the growing market for families and no longer just the province of students. West Davis families,current and future(NW quadrant is most likely next for some type of peripheral residential development)is on the other side of town from Nugget. West Davis residents would need to take the lead in demonstrating that they would be strong supporters of a Coop at Westlake as the Davis Coop doesn’t have the ability to take major speculative financial risks like the national corporate market chains.

  19. davisite

    The Coop board was considering opening a West Davis second location at Westlake Plaza. This would be a great idea. Nugget has recognized that organic produce and products are the growing market for families and no longer just the province of students. West Davis families,current and future(NW quadrant is most likely next for some type of peripheral residential development)is on the other side of town from Nugget. West Davis residents would need to take the lead in demonstrating that they would be strong supporters of a Coop at Westlake as the Davis Coop doesn’t have the ability to take major speculative financial risks like the national corporate market chains.

  20. davisite

    The Coop board was considering opening a West Davis second location at Westlake Plaza. This would be a great idea. Nugget has recognized that organic produce and products are the growing market for families and no longer just the province of students. West Davis families,current and future(NW quadrant is most likely next for some type of peripheral residential development)is on the other side of town from Nugget. West Davis residents would need to take the lead in demonstrating that they would be strong supporters of a Coop at Westlake as the Davis Coop doesn’t have the ability to take major speculative financial risks like the national corporate market chains.

  21. West Davis Neighbor

    West Davis does not need another convenience store. We deserve a good quality grocery store.

    The stores that have not succeeded in West Lake Plaza have not succeeded because they were not well maintained stores. The produce was not the freshest produce, the meat department was not great, the deli left a lot to be desired (we had friends get sick from some food poisoning).

    We live very close but would drive to Safeway, Nugget, or the Co-op for groceries.

    The only thing good about the stores were the clerks that worked there. They were very nice.

    Unfortunately, all of the stores have been quite shabby.

    I think if Mr. Barcewsk made an honest attempt, or if we as West Davisites, sought out a store that was a quality store, it would succeed.

    I’m glad he is finally taking care of the place, but it was a complete eyesore and needed the repairs 8 to 10 years ago.

    The city and the council need to start holding owners of businesses accountable (i.e. Anderson Bank building, the little bungalows downtown, etc.).

    The council should not accept the changes and should instead make an effort to bring in a good grocery store.

  22. West Davis Neighbor

    West Davis does not need another convenience store. We deserve a good quality grocery store.

    The stores that have not succeeded in West Lake Plaza have not succeeded because they were not well maintained stores. The produce was not the freshest produce, the meat department was not great, the deli left a lot to be desired (we had friends get sick from some food poisoning).

    We live very close but would drive to Safeway, Nugget, or the Co-op for groceries.

    The only thing good about the stores were the clerks that worked there. They were very nice.

    Unfortunately, all of the stores have been quite shabby.

    I think if Mr. Barcewsk made an honest attempt, or if we as West Davisites, sought out a store that was a quality store, it would succeed.

    I’m glad he is finally taking care of the place, but it was a complete eyesore and needed the repairs 8 to 10 years ago.

    The city and the council need to start holding owners of businesses accountable (i.e. Anderson Bank building, the little bungalows downtown, etc.).

    The council should not accept the changes and should instead make an effort to bring in a good grocery store.

  23. West Davis Neighbor

    West Davis does not need another convenience store. We deserve a good quality grocery store.

    The stores that have not succeeded in West Lake Plaza have not succeeded because they were not well maintained stores. The produce was not the freshest produce, the meat department was not great, the deli left a lot to be desired (we had friends get sick from some food poisoning).

    We live very close but would drive to Safeway, Nugget, or the Co-op for groceries.

    The only thing good about the stores were the clerks that worked there. They were very nice.

    Unfortunately, all of the stores have been quite shabby.

    I think if Mr. Barcewsk made an honest attempt, or if we as West Davisites, sought out a store that was a quality store, it would succeed.

    I’m glad he is finally taking care of the place, but it was a complete eyesore and needed the repairs 8 to 10 years ago.

    The city and the council need to start holding owners of businesses accountable (i.e. Anderson Bank building, the little bungalows downtown, etc.).

    The council should not accept the changes and should instead make an effort to bring in a good grocery store.

  24. West Davis Neighbor

    West Davis does not need another convenience store. We deserve a good quality grocery store.

    The stores that have not succeeded in West Lake Plaza have not succeeded because they were not well maintained stores. The produce was not the freshest produce, the meat department was not great, the deli left a lot to be desired (we had friends get sick from some food poisoning).

    We live very close but would drive to Safeway, Nugget, or the Co-op for groceries.

    The only thing good about the stores were the clerks that worked there. They were very nice.

    Unfortunately, all of the stores have been quite shabby.

    I think if Mr. Barcewsk made an honest attempt, or if we as West Davisites, sought out a store that was a quality store, it would succeed.

    I’m glad he is finally taking care of the place, but it was a complete eyesore and needed the repairs 8 to 10 years ago.

    The city and the council need to start holding owners of businesses accountable (i.e. Anderson Bank building, the little bungalows downtown, etc.).

    The council should not accept the changes and should instead make an effort to bring in a good grocery store.

  25. don shor

    The quality of the produce, the meat, and the freshness of the deli products are all a function of the turnover. If the foot traffic isn’t there, they won’t be high quality. Given the location, the foot traffic won’t be there. I think two grocery store failures are enough for one shopping center to prove the point that a full-service grocery store is unlikely to make it at that location. Maybe when West Village gets built, if the traffic is reconfigured; maybe when northwest quadrant is built (say, five – ten years from now?) — maybe then a grocery store would survive there. But the development of the Marketplace effectively killed Westlake Plaza.

  26. don shor

    The quality of the produce, the meat, and the freshness of the deli products are all a function of the turnover. If the foot traffic isn’t there, they won’t be high quality. Given the location, the foot traffic won’t be there. I think two grocery store failures are enough for one shopping center to prove the point that a full-service grocery store is unlikely to make it at that location. Maybe when West Village gets built, if the traffic is reconfigured; maybe when northwest quadrant is built (say, five – ten years from now?) — maybe then a grocery store would survive there. But the development of the Marketplace effectively killed Westlake Plaza.

  27. don shor

    The quality of the produce, the meat, and the freshness of the deli products are all a function of the turnover. If the foot traffic isn’t there, they won’t be high quality. Given the location, the foot traffic won’t be there. I think two grocery store failures are enough for one shopping center to prove the point that a full-service grocery store is unlikely to make it at that location. Maybe when West Village gets built, if the traffic is reconfigured; maybe when northwest quadrant is built (say, five – ten years from now?) — maybe then a grocery store would survive there. But the development of the Marketplace effectively killed Westlake Plaza.

  28. don shor

    The quality of the produce, the meat, and the freshness of the deli products are all a function of the turnover. If the foot traffic isn’t there, they won’t be high quality. Given the location, the foot traffic won’t be there. I think two grocery store failures are enough for one shopping center to prove the point that a full-service grocery store is unlikely to make it at that location. Maybe when West Village gets built, if the traffic is reconfigured; maybe when northwest quadrant is built (say, five – ten years from now?) — maybe then a grocery store would survive there. But the development of the Marketplace effectively killed Westlake Plaza.

  29. from the west side of town

    Bel Air or Raley’s would be good grocery stores for the West Lake Plaza location.

    I hope the council doesn’t convert this place and allow the owner to put in more offices or a small 7-11 type store. PLEASE LISTEN – WE DO NOT WANT THAT HERE.

    Convenience stores do not belong in the middle of neighborhoods whereas grocery stores do.

    Thank you for brining this story to our attention. We’ll be carefully monitoring this.

    BTW – The Enterprise quoted Kevin Wolf who doesn’t even live in West Davis. They should be talking with the everyday person in West Davis, and not someone trying to dictate what would be good in our part of town. I appreciate his concern, but they should speak with us.

  30. from the west side of town

    Bel Air or Raley’s would be good grocery stores for the West Lake Plaza location.

    I hope the council doesn’t convert this place and allow the owner to put in more offices or a small 7-11 type store. PLEASE LISTEN – WE DO NOT WANT THAT HERE.

    Convenience stores do not belong in the middle of neighborhoods whereas grocery stores do.

    Thank you for brining this story to our attention. We’ll be carefully monitoring this.

    BTW – The Enterprise quoted Kevin Wolf who doesn’t even live in West Davis. They should be talking with the everyday person in West Davis, and not someone trying to dictate what would be good in our part of town. I appreciate his concern, but they should speak with us.

  31. from the west side of town

    Bel Air or Raley’s would be good grocery stores for the West Lake Plaza location.

    I hope the council doesn’t convert this place and allow the owner to put in more offices or a small 7-11 type store. PLEASE LISTEN – WE DO NOT WANT THAT HERE.

    Convenience stores do not belong in the middle of neighborhoods whereas grocery stores do.

    Thank you for brining this story to our attention. We’ll be carefully monitoring this.

    BTW – The Enterprise quoted Kevin Wolf who doesn’t even live in West Davis. They should be talking with the everyday person in West Davis, and not someone trying to dictate what would be good in our part of town. I appreciate his concern, but they should speak with us.

  32. from the west side of town

    Bel Air or Raley’s would be good grocery stores for the West Lake Plaza location.

    I hope the council doesn’t convert this place and allow the owner to put in more offices or a small 7-11 type store. PLEASE LISTEN – WE DO NOT WANT THAT HERE.

    Convenience stores do not belong in the middle of neighborhoods whereas grocery stores do.

    Thank you for brining this story to our attention. We’ll be carefully monitoring this.

    BTW – The Enterprise quoted Kevin Wolf who doesn’t even live in West Davis. They should be talking with the everyday person in West Davis, and not someone trying to dictate what would be good in our part of town. I appreciate his concern, but they should speak with us.

  33. davis republican

    Regardless of what some people who live in West Davis want, that site does not get the foot traffic to support a larger grocery store. You cannot simply ignore the economic realities simply because west davis residents think it would be nice to have a grocery store nearby.

    As for the co-op, I’ve heard there is disagreement between board members on whether it would be wise to expand at all.

    I think it is very telling that Trader Joe’s did not want that space. I don’t see how Trader Joe’s could fail at any location in Davis – they would be a large enough draw to anchor any center. However, the fact that Trader Joe’s would rather wait and fight to try to get into University Mall says it all. That place is just not viable for a large store.

  34. davis republican

    Regardless of what some people who live in West Davis want, that site does not get the foot traffic to support a larger grocery store. You cannot simply ignore the economic realities simply because west davis residents think it would be nice to have a grocery store nearby.

    As for the co-op, I’ve heard there is disagreement between board members on whether it would be wise to expand at all.

    I think it is very telling that Trader Joe’s did not want that space. I don’t see how Trader Joe’s could fail at any location in Davis – they would be a large enough draw to anchor any center. However, the fact that Trader Joe’s would rather wait and fight to try to get into University Mall says it all. That place is just not viable for a large store.

  35. davis republican

    Regardless of what some people who live in West Davis want, that site does not get the foot traffic to support a larger grocery store. You cannot simply ignore the economic realities simply because west davis residents think it would be nice to have a grocery store nearby.

    As for the co-op, I’ve heard there is disagreement between board members on whether it would be wise to expand at all.

    I think it is very telling that Trader Joe’s did not want that space. I don’t see how Trader Joe’s could fail at any location in Davis – they would be a large enough draw to anchor any center. However, the fact that Trader Joe’s would rather wait and fight to try to get into University Mall says it all. That place is just not viable for a large store.

  36. davis republican

    Regardless of what some people who live in West Davis want, that site does not get the foot traffic to support a larger grocery store. You cannot simply ignore the economic realities simply because west davis residents think it would be nice to have a grocery store nearby.

    As for the co-op, I’ve heard there is disagreement between board members on whether it would be wise to expand at all.

    I think it is very telling that Trader Joe’s did not want that space. I don’t see how Trader Joe’s could fail at any location in Davis – they would be a large enough draw to anchor any center. However, the fact that Trader Joe’s would rather wait and fight to try to get into University Mall says it all. That place is just not viable for a large store.

  37. West Davis Neighbor

    Don,

    Thank you for your input, but I have to strongly disagree with you. You said that,

    “The quality of the produce, the meat, and the freshness of the deli products are all a function of the turnover. If the foot traffic isn’t there, they won’t be high quality.”

    The food was never good quality to begin with, so the stores opened up with poor traffic because of the bad quality and lack of cleanliness of the store. The stores started off with a bad reputation for being a bad store.

    You Don have good quality plants in your store. If you did not, I would never even bother to shop there, so the quality is what will attract consumers.

    The grocery stores that Mr. Barcewsk brought to Westlake Plaza did not even deserve to be labeled “grocery stores.”

    You also state that, “Given the location, the foot traffic won’t be there. I think two grocery store failures are enough for one shopping center to prove the point that a full-service grocery store is unlikely to make it at that location.”

    Again, I strongly disagree with you. I would much rather save gas and time by walking or biking to a good quality grocery store than driving across town. We have enough of a population here to prove that.

    Give us quality and we will shop. Build it and we will come.

    The stores have failed, because the produce was horrible. There were dented cans, not so fresh bread, terrible meat, wilted produce, etc.

    This is not a way to run a business.

    Westlake Plaza killed Westlake Plaza. It looked like a rundown ghetto with cracked pavement, and a building that was falling to pieces, along with a fire alarm that would go off in the middle of the night randomly because it was not repaired. Shabby, shabby, shabby.

    I too hope that council makes the right decision and brings in a good neighborhood grocery store. Bel Air would be good.

  38. West Davis Neighbor

    Don,

    Thank you for your input, but I have to strongly disagree with you. You said that,

    “The quality of the produce, the meat, and the freshness of the deli products are all a function of the turnover. If the foot traffic isn’t there, they won’t be high quality.”

    The food was never good quality to begin with, so the stores opened up with poor traffic because of the bad quality and lack of cleanliness of the store. The stores started off with a bad reputation for being a bad store.

    You Don have good quality plants in your store. If you did not, I would never even bother to shop there, so the quality is what will attract consumers.

    The grocery stores that Mr. Barcewsk brought to Westlake Plaza did not even deserve to be labeled “grocery stores.”

    You also state that, “Given the location, the foot traffic won’t be there. I think two grocery store failures are enough for one shopping center to prove the point that a full-service grocery store is unlikely to make it at that location.”

    Again, I strongly disagree with you. I would much rather save gas and time by walking or biking to a good quality grocery store than driving across town. We have enough of a population here to prove that.

    Give us quality and we will shop. Build it and we will come.

    The stores have failed, because the produce was horrible. There were dented cans, not so fresh bread, terrible meat, wilted produce, etc.

    This is not a way to run a business.

    Westlake Plaza killed Westlake Plaza. It looked like a rundown ghetto with cracked pavement, and a building that was falling to pieces, along with a fire alarm that would go off in the middle of the night randomly because it was not repaired. Shabby, shabby, shabby.

    I too hope that council makes the right decision and brings in a good neighborhood grocery store. Bel Air would be good.

  39. West Davis Neighbor

    Don,

    Thank you for your input, but I have to strongly disagree with you. You said that,

    “The quality of the produce, the meat, and the freshness of the deli products are all a function of the turnover. If the foot traffic isn’t there, they won’t be high quality.”

    The food was never good quality to begin with, so the stores opened up with poor traffic because of the bad quality and lack of cleanliness of the store. The stores started off with a bad reputation for being a bad store.

    You Don have good quality plants in your store. If you did not, I would never even bother to shop there, so the quality is what will attract consumers.

    The grocery stores that Mr. Barcewsk brought to Westlake Plaza did not even deserve to be labeled “grocery stores.”

    You also state that, “Given the location, the foot traffic won’t be there. I think two grocery store failures are enough for one shopping center to prove the point that a full-service grocery store is unlikely to make it at that location.”

    Again, I strongly disagree with you. I would much rather save gas and time by walking or biking to a good quality grocery store than driving across town. We have enough of a population here to prove that.

    Give us quality and we will shop. Build it and we will come.

    The stores have failed, because the produce was horrible. There were dented cans, not so fresh bread, terrible meat, wilted produce, etc.

    This is not a way to run a business.

    Westlake Plaza killed Westlake Plaza. It looked like a rundown ghetto with cracked pavement, and a building that was falling to pieces, along with a fire alarm that would go off in the middle of the night randomly because it was not repaired. Shabby, shabby, shabby.

    I too hope that council makes the right decision and brings in a good neighborhood grocery store. Bel Air would be good.

  40. West Davis Neighbor

    Don,

    Thank you for your input, but I have to strongly disagree with you. You said that,

    “The quality of the produce, the meat, and the freshness of the deli products are all a function of the turnover. If the foot traffic isn’t there, they won’t be high quality.”

    The food was never good quality to begin with, so the stores opened up with poor traffic because of the bad quality and lack of cleanliness of the store. The stores started off with a bad reputation for being a bad store.

    You Don have good quality plants in your store. If you did not, I would never even bother to shop there, so the quality is what will attract consumers.

    The grocery stores that Mr. Barcewsk brought to Westlake Plaza did not even deserve to be labeled “grocery stores.”

    You also state that, “Given the location, the foot traffic won’t be there. I think two grocery store failures are enough for one shopping center to prove the point that a full-service grocery store is unlikely to make it at that location.”

    Again, I strongly disagree with you. I would much rather save gas and time by walking or biking to a good quality grocery store than driving across town. We have enough of a population here to prove that.

    Give us quality and we will shop. Build it and we will come.

    The stores have failed, because the produce was horrible. There were dented cans, not so fresh bread, terrible meat, wilted produce, etc.

    This is not a way to run a business.

    Westlake Plaza killed Westlake Plaza. It looked like a rundown ghetto with cracked pavement, and a building that was falling to pieces, along with a fire alarm that would go off in the middle of the night randomly because it was not repaired. Shabby, shabby, shabby.

    I too hope that council makes the right decision and brings in a good neighborhood grocery store. Bel Air would be good.

  41. West Davis Neighbor

    Republican –

    Trader Joe’s in Any City, USA will only locate itself where there is a major intersection nearby.

    Never mind the fact that there is bird poop all over the place and they have upset a lot of us who refuse to even shop there because of the way they have attempted to bully themselves into the location.

    If they opened up a grocery store with a Peete’s coffee, or some other anchor stores then people would shop there. There needs to be other anchor stores too.

    It’s sheer laziness and now the owner wants a bailout.

  42. West Davis Neighbor

    Republican –

    Trader Joe’s in Any City, USA will only locate itself where there is a major intersection nearby.

    Never mind the fact that there is bird poop all over the place and they have upset a lot of us who refuse to even shop there because of the way they have attempted to bully themselves into the location.

    If they opened up a grocery store with a Peete’s coffee, or some other anchor stores then people would shop there. There needs to be other anchor stores too.

    It’s sheer laziness and now the owner wants a bailout.

  43. West Davis Neighbor

    Republican –

    Trader Joe’s in Any City, USA will only locate itself where there is a major intersection nearby.

    Never mind the fact that there is bird poop all over the place and they have upset a lot of us who refuse to even shop there because of the way they have attempted to bully themselves into the location.

    If they opened up a grocery store with a Peete’s coffee, or some other anchor stores then people would shop there. There needs to be other anchor stores too.

    It’s sheer laziness and now the owner wants a bailout.

  44. West Davis Neighbor

    Republican –

    Trader Joe’s in Any City, USA will only locate itself where there is a major intersection nearby.

    Never mind the fact that there is bird poop all over the place and they have upset a lot of us who refuse to even shop there because of the way they have attempted to bully themselves into the location.

    If they opened up a grocery store with a Peete’s coffee, or some other anchor stores then people would shop there. There needs to be other anchor stores too.

    It’s sheer laziness and now the owner wants a bailout.

  45. don shor

    I remember when Ray’s opened, I had high hopes for them. That was a chain that seemed to specialize in smaller cities, member of the IGA network, etc. But I watched as they deteriorated, and I definitely agree the Food Fair was hopeless. It becomes a spiral as traffic leaves, the landlord fails to upgrade, the quality dwindles.
    Maybe a concerted effort by west Davis residents to recruit a supermarket chain to look at the location would work. I don’t think the landlord will do it.

    Isn’t this the kind of thing our Business and Economic Development Commission is supposed to be working on?

  46. don shor

    I remember when Ray’s opened, I had high hopes for them. That was a chain that seemed to specialize in smaller cities, member of the IGA network, etc. But I watched as they deteriorated, and I definitely agree the Food Fair was hopeless. It becomes a spiral as traffic leaves, the landlord fails to upgrade, the quality dwindles.
    Maybe a concerted effort by west Davis residents to recruit a supermarket chain to look at the location would work. I don’t think the landlord will do it.

    Isn’t this the kind of thing our Business and Economic Development Commission is supposed to be working on?

  47. don shor

    I remember when Ray’s opened, I had high hopes for them. That was a chain that seemed to specialize in smaller cities, member of the IGA network, etc. But I watched as they deteriorated, and I definitely agree the Food Fair was hopeless. It becomes a spiral as traffic leaves, the landlord fails to upgrade, the quality dwindles.
    Maybe a concerted effort by west Davis residents to recruit a supermarket chain to look at the location would work. I don’t think the landlord will do it.

    Isn’t this the kind of thing our Business and Economic Development Commission is supposed to be working on?

  48. don shor

    I remember when Ray’s opened, I had high hopes for them. That was a chain that seemed to specialize in smaller cities, member of the IGA network, etc. But I watched as they deteriorated, and I definitely agree the Food Fair was hopeless. It becomes a spiral as traffic leaves, the landlord fails to upgrade, the quality dwindles.
    Maybe a concerted effort by west Davis residents to recruit a supermarket chain to look at the location would work. I don’t think the landlord will do it.

    Isn’t this the kind of thing our Business and Economic Development Commission is supposed to be working on?

  49. Anonymous

    I think it is city staff that should be working on this and they have not done so.

    If Bill Emlen is managing the city and he sees that there is a problem (which he is not even from Davis, so maybe that is why he doesn’t care or even notice) he should direct staff to work on this problem and talk with potential businesses to locate at WLP.

    At the direction of council they would, but this has been another blunder of the council and city manager.

  50. Anonymous

    I think it is city staff that should be working on this and they have not done so.

    If Bill Emlen is managing the city and he sees that there is a problem (which he is not even from Davis, so maybe that is why he doesn’t care or even notice) he should direct staff to work on this problem and talk with potential businesses to locate at WLP.

    At the direction of council they would, but this has been another blunder of the council and city manager.

  51. Anonymous

    I think it is city staff that should be working on this and they have not done so.

    If Bill Emlen is managing the city and he sees that there is a problem (which he is not even from Davis, so maybe that is why he doesn’t care or even notice) he should direct staff to work on this problem and talk with potential businesses to locate at WLP.

    At the direction of council they would, but this has been another blunder of the council and city manager.

  52. Anonymous

    I think it is city staff that should be working on this and they have not done so.

    If Bill Emlen is managing the city and he sees that there is a problem (which he is not even from Davis, so maybe that is why he doesn’t care or even notice) he should direct staff to work on this problem and talk with potential businesses to locate at WLP.

    At the direction of council they would, but this has been another blunder of the council and city manager.

  53. davisite

    “As for the co-op, I’ve heard there is disagreement between board members on whether it would be wise to expand at all.”

    The Coop Board’s reluctance to consider expansion could be removed if ways were found to minimize the financial risk in this speculative venture that “deep pocket” national chains are able to absorb.

  54. davisite

    “As for the co-op, I’ve heard there is disagreement between board members on whether it would be wise to expand at all.”

    The Coop Board’s reluctance to consider expansion could be removed if ways were found to minimize the financial risk in this speculative venture that “deep pocket” national chains are able to absorb.

  55. davisite

    “As for the co-op, I’ve heard there is disagreement between board members on whether it would be wise to expand at all.”

    The Coop Board’s reluctance to consider expansion could be removed if ways were found to minimize the financial risk in this speculative venture that “deep pocket” national chains are able to absorb.

  56. davisite

    “As for the co-op, I’ve heard there is disagreement between board members on whether it would be wise to expand at all.”

    The Coop Board’s reluctance to consider expansion could be removed if ways were found to minimize the financial risk in this speculative venture that “deep pocket” national chains are able to absorb.

  57. don shor

    Out of curiosity, I opened the BEDC minutes from the last couple of meetings that are posted. It seems that updates are given on Westlake Village, but there isn’t any detail. Sarah Worley is the city contact, and I think she would be responsive to any inquiries or comments on this.

    sworley@ci.davis.ca.us

  58. don shor

    Out of curiosity, I opened the BEDC minutes from the last couple of meetings that are posted. It seems that updates are given on Westlake Village, but there isn’t any detail. Sarah Worley is the city contact, and I think she would be responsive to any inquiries or comments on this.

    sworley@ci.davis.ca.us

  59. don shor

    Out of curiosity, I opened the BEDC minutes from the last couple of meetings that are posted. It seems that updates are given on Westlake Village, but there isn’t any detail. Sarah Worley is the city contact, and I think she would be responsive to any inquiries or comments on this.

    sworley@ci.davis.ca.us

  60. don shor

    Out of curiosity, I opened the BEDC minutes from the last couple of meetings that are posted. It seems that updates are given on Westlake Village, but there isn’t any detail. Sarah Worley is the city contact, and I think she would be responsive to any inquiries or comments on this.

    sworley@ci.davis.ca.us

  61. Sue Greenwald

    Believe me, staff has worked for years to try to convince Trader Joe’s to consider one of our shopping center sites that lacks a grocery store. The only such site that Trader Joe’s was willing to consider was University Mall.

    When I read over a year ago that Tesco was considering expanding the number of their smaller grocery stores in underserved neighborhoods, I called Ken Hiatt to suggest that he show them Westlake and Davis Manor.

    He told me that he was already talking with them.

    If anyone has any other suggestions for other grocers, you can let Ken Hiatt know, or e-mail me and I will pass it on to him.

    I know that staff pursues all leads.

  62. Sue Greenwald

    Believe me, staff has worked for years to try to convince Trader Joe’s to consider one of our shopping center sites that lacks a grocery store. The only such site that Trader Joe’s was willing to consider was University Mall.

    When I read over a year ago that Tesco was considering expanding the number of their smaller grocery stores in underserved neighborhoods, I called Ken Hiatt to suggest that he show them Westlake and Davis Manor.

    He told me that he was already talking with them.

    If anyone has any other suggestions for other grocers, you can let Ken Hiatt know, or e-mail me and I will pass it on to him.

    I know that staff pursues all leads.

  63. Sue Greenwald

    Believe me, staff has worked for years to try to convince Trader Joe’s to consider one of our shopping center sites that lacks a grocery store. The only such site that Trader Joe’s was willing to consider was University Mall.

    When I read over a year ago that Tesco was considering expanding the number of their smaller grocery stores in underserved neighborhoods, I called Ken Hiatt to suggest that he show them Westlake and Davis Manor.

    He told me that he was already talking with them.

    If anyone has any other suggestions for other grocers, you can let Ken Hiatt know, or e-mail me and I will pass it on to him.

    I know that staff pursues all leads.

  64. Sue Greenwald

    Believe me, staff has worked for years to try to convince Trader Joe’s to consider one of our shopping center sites that lacks a grocery store. The only such site that Trader Joe’s was willing to consider was University Mall.

    When I read over a year ago that Tesco was considering expanding the number of their smaller grocery stores in underserved neighborhoods, I called Ken Hiatt to suggest that he show them Westlake and Davis Manor.

    He told me that he was already talking with them.

    If anyone has any other suggestions for other grocers, you can let Ken Hiatt know, or e-mail me and I will pass it on to him.

    I know that staff pursues all leads.

  65. Sue Greenwald

    That said, if the neighborhood doesn’t want to convenience store, I feel under no obligation to rezone for one. As far as I am concerned, this should ultimately be a neighborhood decision.

  66. Sue Greenwald

    That said, if the neighborhood doesn’t want to convenience store, I feel under no obligation to rezone for one. As far as I am concerned, this should ultimately be a neighborhood decision.

  67. Sue Greenwald

    That said, if the neighborhood doesn’t want to convenience store, I feel under no obligation to rezone for one. As far as I am concerned, this should ultimately be a neighborhood decision.

  68. Sue Greenwald

    That said, if the neighborhood doesn’t want to convenience store, I feel under no obligation to rezone for one. As far as I am concerned, this should ultimately be a neighborhood decision.

  69. Doug Paul Davis

    I live next door to Westlake. There is a convenience store, Circle K on Lake and Covell, just three blocks away. So it doesn’t make a lot of sense to have two convenience stores.

  70. Doug Paul Davis

    I live next door to Westlake. There is a convenience store, Circle K on Lake and Covell, just three blocks away. So it doesn’t make a lot of sense to have two convenience stores.

  71. Doug Paul Davis

    I live next door to Westlake. There is a convenience store, Circle K on Lake and Covell, just three blocks away. So it doesn’t make a lot of sense to have two convenience stores.

  72. Doug Paul Davis

    I live next door to Westlake. There is a convenience store, Circle K on Lake and Covell, just three blocks away. So it doesn’t make a lot of sense to have two convenience stores.

  73. West Davisite

    Westlake Plaza has not done well because 1) the grocery stores were awful as others have already said; 2) the rent is too high. Question: how can developers allow a huge project like Westlake Plaza to sit empty for so many years and not be forced to reduce their rent for their own fiscal viability? Can someone explain that to me?

    I agree with DPD, we do not need another convenience store in West Davis. A number of small specialty grocery shops within a grocery store might work, as was suggested some time ago. But who is responsible for recruiting business to a location? Isn’t that really the job of the developer? How much can the city do? I really want to know.

    I think I have more questions than answers in this arena…

  74. West Davisite

    Westlake Plaza has not done well because 1) the grocery stores were awful as others have already said; 2) the rent is too high. Question: how can developers allow a huge project like Westlake Plaza to sit empty for so many years and not be forced to reduce their rent for their own fiscal viability? Can someone explain that to me?

    I agree with DPD, we do not need another convenience store in West Davis. A number of small specialty grocery shops within a grocery store might work, as was suggested some time ago. But who is responsible for recruiting business to a location? Isn’t that really the job of the developer? How much can the city do? I really want to know.

    I think I have more questions than answers in this arena…

  75. West Davisite

    Westlake Plaza has not done well because 1) the grocery stores were awful as others have already said; 2) the rent is too high. Question: how can developers allow a huge project like Westlake Plaza to sit empty for so many years and not be forced to reduce their rent for their own fiscal viability? Can someone explain that to me?

    I agree with DPD, we do not need another convenience store in West Davis. A number of small specialty grocery shops within a grocery store might work, as was suggested some time ago. But who is responsible for recruiting business to a location? Isn’t that really the job of the developer? How much can the city do? I really want to know.

    I think I have more questions than answers in this arena…

  76. West Davisite

    Westlake Plaza has not done well because 1) the grocery stores were awful as others have already said; 2) the rent is too high. Question: how can developers allow a huge project like Westlake Plaza to sit empty for so many years and not be forced to reduce their rent for their own fiscal viability? Can someone explain that to me?

    I agree with DPD, we do not need another convenience store in West Davis. A number of small specialty grocery shops within a grocery store might work, as was suggested some time ago. But who is responsible for recruiting business to a location? Isn’t that really the job of the developer? How much can the city do? I really want to know.

    I think I have more questions than answers in this arena…

  77. West Davis Local

    “Question: how can developers allow a huge project like Westlake Plaza to sit empty for so many years and not be forced to reduce their rent for their own fiscal viability? Can someone explain that to me?”

    Al Smith was the developer of Westlake (then call Farmtown), and he asserts that a grocery store was profitable during the period that he owned the project.

    Current owner Mr. Barcewski has quite a few holdings. This is one of his smaller projects.

    How can he allow the space to stay vacant? Simple. He has the financial staying power to sustain the loss for some period of time. (He may have incentive to do so, if he believes that it will untimately bring about the permit changes he desires.)

    I hope he is serious about his most recent proposal for a 6,000-SF store. That would be better than 15,000 SF for him, and better than 3,000 SF for the neighborhood (assuming a successful grocer takes the space). We’ll have to watch and see if that comes to pass at $1.50/SF.

  78. West Davis Local

    “Question: how can developers allow a huge project like Westlake Plaza to sit empty for so many years and not be forced to reduce their rent for their own fiscal viability? Can someone explain that to me?”

    Al Smith was the developer of Westlake (then call Farmtown), and he asserts that a grocery store was profitable during the period that he owned the project.

    Current owner Mr. Barcewski has quite a few holdings. This is one of his smaller projects.

    How can he allow the space to stay vacant? Simple. He has the financial staying power to sustain the loss for some period of time. (He may have incentive to do so, if he believes that it will untimately bring about the permit changes he desires.)

    I hope he is serious about his most recent proposal for a 6,000-SF store. That would be better than 15,000 SF for him, and better than 3,000 SF for the neighborhood (assuming a successful grocer takes the space). We’ll have to watch and see if that comes to pass at $1.50/SF.

  79. West Davis Local

    “Question: how can developers allow a huge project like Westlake Plaza to sit empty for so many years and not be forced to reduce their rent for their own fiscal viability? Can someone explain that to me?”

    Al Smith was the developer of Westlake (then call Farmtown), and he asserts that a grocery store was profitable during the period that he owned the project.

    Current owner Mr. Barcewski has quite a few holdings. This is one of his smaller projects.

    How can he allow the space to stay vacant? Simple. He has the financial staying power to sustain the loss for some period of time. (He may have incentive to do so, if he believes that it will untimately bring about the permit changes he desires.)

    I hope he is serious about his most recent proposal for a 6,000-SF store. That would be better than 15,000 SF for him, and better than 3,000 SF for the neighborhood (assuming a successful grocer takes the space). We’ll have to watch and see if that comes to pass at $1.50/SF.

  80. West Davis Local

    “Question: how can developers allow a huge project like Westlake Plaza to sit empty for so many years and not be forced to reduce their rent for their own fiscal viability? Can someone explain that to me?”

    Al Smith was the developer of Westlake (then call Farmtown), and he asserts that a grocery store was profitable during the period that he owned the project.

    Current owner Mr. Barcewski has quite a few holdings. This is one of his smaller projects.

    How can he allow the space to stay vacant? Simple. He has the financial staying power to sustain the loss for some period of time. (He may have incentive to do so, if he believes that it will untimately bring about the permit changes he desires.)

    I hope he is serious about his most recent proposal for a 6,000-SF store. That would be better than 15,000 SF for him, and better than 3,000 SF for the neighborhood (assuming a successful grocer takes the space). We’ll have to watch and see if that comes to pass at $1.50/SF.

  81. from the darkside

    putting another small grocery store at Westlake will not work because Westlake has been through 3 of them already and all have folded.

    Whatever type of store comes there, I think if it is another “mom and pop” operation, it will fail. You need a good franchise that has more staying power and can better afford to take financial hits. I think a Store like Trader Joe would work.

    I also think you need several operations at once. Perhaps a few franchise restaurants in conjunction with another Borders Books might work.

  82. from the darkside

    putting another small grocery store at Westlake will not work because Westlake has been through 3 of them already and all have folded.

    Whatever type of store comes there, I think if it is another “mom and pop” operation, it will fail. You need a good franchise that has more staying power and can better afford to take financial hits. I think a Store like Trader Joe would work.

    I also think you need several operations at once. Perhaps a few franchise restaurants in conjunction with another Borders Books might work.

  83. from the darkside

    putting another small grocery store at Westlake will not work because Westlake has been through 3 of them already and all have folded.

    Whatever type of store comes there, I think if it is another “mom and pop” operation, it will fail. You need a good franchise that has more staying power and can better afford to take financial hits. I think a Store like Trader Joe would work.

    I also think you need several operations at once. Perhaps a few franchise restaurants in conjunction with another Borders Books might work.

  84. from the darkside

    putting another small grocery store at Westlake will not work because Westlake has been through 3 of them already and all have folded.

    Whatever type of store comes there, I think if it is another “mom and pop” operation, it will fail. You need a good franchise that has more staying power and can better afford to take financial hits. I think a Store like Trader Joe would work.

    I also think you need several operations at once. Perhaps a few franchise restaurants in conjunction with another Borders Books might work.

  85. from the darkside

    Sue,

    Just because Univ. Mall was the only site TJ’s was willing to go to did not mean it was right for you and the rest of the council to rezone the RAS site to give TJ leverage to shove out RAS, when RAS was there first and had a written lease.

  86. from the darkside

    Sue,

    Just because Univ. Mall was the only site TJ’s was willing to go to did not mean it was right for you and the rest of the council to rezone the RAS site to give TJ leverage to shove out RAS, when RAS was there first and had a written lease.

  87. from the darkside

    Sue,

    Just because Univ. Mall was the only site TJ’s was willing to go to did not mean it was right for you and the rest of the council to rezone the RAS site to give TJ leverage to shove out RAS, when RAS was there first and had a written lease.

  88. from the darkside

    Sue,

    Just because Univ. Mall was the only site TJ’s was willing to go to did not mean it was right for you and the rest of the council to rezone the RAS site to give TJ leverage to shove out RAS, when RAS was there first and had a written lease.

  89. curious

    “…when RAS was there first and had a written lease.”

    Reportedly, RAS did not sign a new lease with the new University Mall owners. Are leases automatically transferable when ownership changes?
    Did this lease transfer clause have to be spelled out in their old lease for RAS to have a valid claim?

  90. curious

    “…when RAS was there first and had a written lease.”

    Reportedly, RAS did not sign a new lease with the new University Mall owners. Are leases automatically transferable when ownership changes?
    Did this lease transfer clause have to be spelled out in their old lease for RAS to have a valid claim?

  91. curious

    “…when RAS was there first and had a written lease.”

    Reportedly, RAS did not sign a new lease with the new University Mall owners. Are leases automatically transferable when ownership changes?
    Did this lease transfer clause have to be spelled out in their old lease for RAS to have a valid claim?

  92. curious

    “…when RAS was there first and had a written lease.”

    Reportedly, RAS did not sign a new lease with the new University Mall owners. Are leases automatically transferable when ownership changes?
    Did this lease transfer clause have to be spelled out in their old lease for RAS to have a valid claim?

  93. watching council closely

    Council was wrong to cave in to Trader Joe’s.

    We need to bring in several big name franchise stores to WLV to help it succeed.

    A grocery store (someone mentioned Bel Air or Raley’s and it sounds good to me)

    A book store – a good one, but it doesn’t have to be Border’s. One is enough.

    A coffee shop and some other specialty stores would do just fine.

    I hope council doesn’t get in the way of allowing this to happen. I hope they are listening carefully.

  94. watching council closely

    Council was wrong to cave in to Trader Joe’s.

    We need to bring in several big name franchise stores to WLV to help it succeed.

    A grocery store (someone mentioned Bel Air or Raley’s and it sounds good to me)

    A book store – a good one, but it doesn’t have to be Border’s. One is enough.

    A coffee shop and some other specialty stores would do just fine.

    I hope council doesn’t get in the way of allowing this to happen. I hope they are listening carefully.

  95. watching council closely

    Council was wrong to cave in to Trader Joe’s.

    We need to bring in several big name franchise stores to WLV to help it succeed.

    A grocery store (someone mentioned Bel Air or Raley’s and it sounds good to me)

    A book store – a good one, but it doesn’t have to be Border’s. One is enough.

    A coffee shop and some other specialty stores would do just fine.

    I hope council doesn’t get in the way of allowing this to happen. I hope they are listening carefully.

  96. watching council closely

    Council was wrong to cave in to Trader Joe’s.

    We need to bring in several big name franchise stores to WLV to help it succeed.

    A grocery store (someone mentioned Bel Air or Raley’s and it sounds good to me)

    A book store – a good one, but it doesn’t have to be Border’s. One is enough.

    A coffee shop and some other specialty stores would do just fine.

    I hope council doesn’t get in the way of allowing this to happen. I hope they are listening carefully.

  97. 無名 - wu ming

    the ongoing farmtown/westlake saga is so incredibly irritating. there is more than enough people, were a decent grocery to actually set up shop there. the strip mall is surrounded by high density apartments on all sides, and would be the only spot west of 113.

    the problem is that the guy who ran farmtown didn’t have a clue how to run his business, so that even when the traffic was good, he lost fistfulls of money. ray’s and food fair were atrociously run businesses and were utterly tone deaf about serving the predictable demands of the neighborhood:

    1. lots of apartments with lots of students = alcohol and microwave food.

    2. older affluent stonegate and village homes homewoners = good organic produce, nice meat and deli section, and extensive wine and cheese section (ie. another nugget or post-remodel co-op)

    provide those two things, make sure the spot is well stocked and with adequate checkers for the first month, and heavily flyer the neighborhood west of 113 with ads saying “hey, we’re here, and we promise we’ll have what you want!” and my guess is that a smaller but not tiny grocery store would do fine.

    the owner was never serious about trying to get a tenant, he filled up the loading dock with dirt and rubble just a few months after food fair gave up the ghost. a convenience store would be a betrayal of the very principle of neighborhood shopping centers that is written into the planning documents.

    the city council seriously erred when it allowed state market to be replaced by costplus world market; please don’t botch it again with westlake center. adding a convenience store will not serve our needs, the effect will be essentially like leaving it vacant, with all the extra miles driven across town to get the rest of the stuff on the shopping list.

  98. 無名 - wu ming

    the ongoing farmtown/westlake saga is so incredibly irritating. there is more than enough people, were a decent grocery to actually set up shop there. the strip mall is surrounded by high density apartments on all sides, and would be the only spot west of 113.

    the problem is that the guy who ran farmtown didn’t have a clue how to run his business, so that even when the traffic was good, he lost fistfulls of money. ray’s and food fair were atrociously run businesses and were utterly tone deaf about serving the predictable demands of the neighborhood:

    1. lots of apartments with lots of students = alcohol and microwave food.

    2. older affluent stonegate and village homes homewoners = good organic produce, nice meat and deli section, and extensive wine and cheese section (ie. another nugget or post-remodel co-op)

    provide those two things, make sure the spot is well stocked and with adequate checkers for the first month, and heavily flyer the neighborhood west of 113 with ads saying “hey, we’re here, and we promise we’ll have what you want!” and my guess is that a smaller but not tiny grocery store would do fine.

    the owner was never serious about trying to get a tenant, he filled up the loading dock with dirt and rubble just a few months after food fair gave up the ghost. a convenience store would be a betrayal of the very principle of neighborhood shopping centers that is written into the planning documents.

    the city council seriously erred when it allowed state market to be replaced by costplus world market; please don’t botch it again with westlake center. adding a convenience store will not serve our needs, the effect will be essentially like leaving it vacant, with all the extra miles driven across town to get the rest of the stuff on the shopping list.

  99. 無名 - wu ming

    the ongoing farmtown/westlake saga is so incredibly irritating. there is more than enough people, were a decent grocery to actually set up shop there. the strip mall is surrounded by high density apartments on all sides, and would be the only spot west of 113.

    the problem is that the guy who ran farmtown didn’t have a clue how to run his business, so that even when the traffic was good, he lost fistfulls of money. ray’s and food fair were atrociously run businesses and were utterly tone deaf about serving the predictable demands of the neighborhood:

    1. lots of apartments with lots of students = alcohol and microwave food.

    2. older affluent stonegate and village homes homewoners = good organic produce, nice meat and deli section, and extensive wine and cheese section (ie. another nugget or post-remodel co-op)

    provide those two things, make sure the spot is well stocked and with adequate checkers for the first month, and heavily flyer the neighborhood west of 113 with ads saying “hey, we’re here, and we promise we’ll have what you want!” and my guess is that a smaller but not tiny grocery store would do fine.

    the owner was never serious about trying to get a tenant, he filled up the loading dock with dirt and rubble just a few months after food fair gave up the ghost. a convenience store would be a betrayal of the very principle of neighborhood shopping centers that is written into the planning documents.

    the city council seriously erred when it allowed state market to be replaced by costplus world market; please don’t botch it again with westlake center. adding a convenience store will not serve our needs, the effect will be essentially like leaving it vacant, with all the extra miles driven across town to get the rest of the stuff on the shopping list.

  100. 無名 - wu ming

    the ongoing farmtown/westlake saga is so incredibly irritating. there is more than enough people, were a decent grocery to actually set up shop there. the strip mall is surrounded by high density apartments on all sides, and would be the only spot west of 113.

    the problem is that the guy who ran farmtown didn’t have a clue how to run his business, so that even when the traffic was good, he lost fistfulls of money. ray’s and food fair were atrociously run businesses and were utterly tone deaf about serving the predictable demands of the neighborhood:

    1. lots of apartments with lots of students = alcohol and microwave food.

    2. older affluent stonegate and village homes homewoners = good organic produce, nice meat and deli section, and extensive wine and cheese section (ie. another nugget or post-remodel co-op)

    provide those two things, make sure the spot is well stocked and with adequate checkers for the first month, and heavily flyer the neighborhood west of 113 with ads saying “hey, we’re here, and we promise we’ll have what you want!” and my guess is that a smaller but not tiny grocery store would do fine.

    the owner was never serious about trying to get a tenant, he filled up the loading dock with dirt and rubble just a few months after food fair gave up the ghost. a convenience store would be a betrayal of the very principle of neighborhood shopping centers that is written into the planning documents.

    the city council seriously erred when it allowed state market to be replaced by costplus world market; please don’t botch it again with westlake center. adding a convenience store will not serve our needs, the effect will be essentially like leaving it vacant, with all the extra miles driven across town to get the rest of the stuff on the shopping list.

  101. 無名 - wu ming

    oh, and i’d like to second the coffee shop idea as well. that many students in the vicinity, and vacant store space, and not a real cafe to be found (and no, the vestigal cafe attached to the video store/former post office branch doesn’t count)?

    if that owner claims he can get all these bakeries and shops and stuff, why hasn’t he tried to fill in the non-grocery store slots already?

  102. 無名 - wu ming

    oh, and i’d like to second the coffee shop idea as well. that many students in the vicinity, and vacant store space, and not a real cafe to be found (and no, the vestigal cafe attached to the video store/former post office branch doesn’t count)?

    if that owner claims he can get all these bakeries and shops and stuff, why hasn’t he tried to fill in the non-grocery store slots already?

  103. 無名 - wu ming

    oh, and i’d like to second the coffee shop idea as well. that many students in the vicinity, and vacant store space, and not a real cafe to be found (and no, the vestigal cafe attached to the video store/former post office branch doesn’t count)?

    if that owner claims he can get all these bakeries and shops and stuff, why hasn’t he tried to fill in the non-grocery store slots already?

  104. 無名 - wu ming

    oh, and i’d like to second the coffee shop idea as well. that many students in the vicinity, and vacant store space, and not a real cafe to be found (and no, the vestigal cafe attached to the video store/former post office branch doesn’t count)?

    if that owner claims he can get all these bakeries and shops and stuff, why hasn’t he tried to fill in the non-grocery store slots already?

  105. Anonymous

    Bravo Wu Ming!!! You hit the nail on the head.The points you make are very good points and I too hope council doesn’t make another blunder on this issue.

    There is absolutely no reason that a store, as you described, would not work in this area. There are lots of apartments and homes. All that is needed is a good store that doesn’t carry shoddy products, or food items.

    It is only within the last 6 months that the owner has finally started to take care of the the place.

    Perhaps we should flood him with ideas?

  106. Anonymous

    Bravo Wu Ming!!! You hit the nail on the head.The points you make are very good points and I too hope council doesn’t make another blunder on this issue.

    There is absolutely no reason that a store, as you described, would not work in this area. There are lots of apartments and homes. All that is needed is a good store that doesn’t carry shoddy products, or food items.

    It is only within the last 6 months that the owner has finally started to take care of the the place.

    Perhaps we should flood him with ideas?

  107. Anonymous

    Bravo Wu Ming!!! You hit the nail on the head.The points you make are very good points and I too hope council doesn’t make another blunder on this issue.

    There is absolutely no reason that a store, as you described, would not work in this area. There are lots of apartments and homes. All that is needed is a good store that doesn’t carry shoddy products, or food items.

    It is only within the last 6 months that the owner has finally started to take care of the the place.

    Perhaps we should flood him with ideas?

  108. Anonymous

    Bravo Wu Ming!!! You hit the nail on the head.The points you make are very good points and I too hope council doesn’t make another blunder on this issue.

    There is absolutely no reason that a store, as you described, would not work in this area. There are lots of apartments and homes. All that is needed is a good store that doesn’t carry shoddy products, or food items.

    It is only within the last 6 months that the owner has finally started to take care of the the place.

    Perhaps we should flood him with ideas?

  109. 無名 - wu ming

    well, the guy is offering free pizza on the 13th in exchange for neighbors offering opinions. hopefully west davisites will take advantage of the offer and give him some suggestions.

  110. 無名 - wu ming

    well, the guy is offering free pizza on the 13th in exchange for neighbors offering opinions. hopefully west davisites will take advantage of the offer and give him some suggestions.

  111. 無名 - wu ming

    well, the guy is offering free pizza on the 13th in exchange for neighbors offering opinions. hopefully west davisites will take advantage of the offer and give him some suggestions.

  112. 無名 - wu ming

    well, the guy is offering free pizza on the 13th in exchange for neighbors offering opinions. hopefully west davisites will take advantage of the offer and give him some suggestions.

  113. Anonymous

    Wouldn’t a thriving grocery store and mall in that location just encourage development west of Davis? This mall is on the very edge of town, and Safeway is only 1 to 1 1/2 miles away. I have to drive farther to get to a grocery store from Mace Ranch. Why do we need a grocery store in West Davis?

  114. Anonymous

    Wouldn’t a thriving grocery store and mall in that location just encourage development west of Davis? This mall is on the very edge of town, and Safeway is only 1 to 1 1/2 miles away. I have to drive farther to get to a grocery store from Mace Ranch. Why do we need a grocery store in West Davis?

  115. Anonymous

    Wouldn’t a thriving grocery store and mall in that location just encourage development west of Davis? This mall is on the very edge of town, and Safeway is only 1 to 1 1/2 miles away. I have to drive farther to get to a grocery store from Mace Ranch. Why do we need a grocery store in West Davis?

  116. Anonymous

    Wouldn’t a thriving grocery store and mall in that location just encourage development west of Davis? This mall is on the very edge of town, and Safeway is only 1 to 1 1/2 miles away. I have to drive farther to get to a grocery store from Mace Ranch. Why do we need a grocery store in West Davis?

  117. Coop member

    This location needs to be able to compete with Safeway Marketplace and the Anderson Shopping Center discount market by offering a SUPERIOR deli, meat department,organic produce and fresh baked bread(Village bakery).. all part of the Davis Coop operation. The owner needs to offer the Coop a deal that they can’t refuse.

  118. Coop member

    This location needs to be able to compete with Safeway Marketplace and the Anderson Shopping Center discount market by offering a SUPERIOR deli, meat department,organic produce and fresh baked bread(Village bakery).. all part of the Davis Coop operation. The owner needs to offer the Coop a deal that they can’t refuse.

  119. Coop member

    This location needs to be able to compete with Safeway Marketplace and the Anderson Shopping Center discount market by offering a SUPERIOR deli, meat department,organic produce and fresh baked bread(Village bakery).. all part of the Davis Coop operation. The owner needs to offer the Coop a deal that they can’t refuse.

  120. Coop member

    This location needs to be able to compete with Safeway Marketplace and the Anderson Shopping Center discount market by offering a SUPERIOR deli, meat department,organic produce and fresh baked bread(Village bakery).. all part of the Davis Coop operation. The owner needs to offer the Coop a deal that they can’t refuse.

  121. Anonymous

    DPD,
    No one commented on your statement regarding the Parks. I too think the Parks in Davis are fantastic for kids and adults. However there is one exception, Central Park.
    On the few ocassions I have taken my children there we have been subjected to panhandling,foul language,insults and drunken or drug induced bad behavior by some of the homeless scumbags there. Other than that you are right, the parks are GREAT and play equipment needs to be maintained properly.

  122. Anonymous

    DPD,
    No one commented on your statement regarding the Parks. I too think the Parks in Davis are fantastic for kids and adults. However there is one exception, Central Park.
    On the few ocassions I have taken my children there we have been subjected to panhandling,foul language,insults and drunken or drug induced bad behavior by some of the homeless scumbags there. Other than that you are right, the parks are GREAT and play equipment needs to be maintained properly.

  123. Anonymous

    DPD,
    No one commented on your statement regarding the Parks. I too think the Parks in Davis are fantastic for kids and adults. However there is one exception, Central Park.
    On the few ocassions I have taken my children there we have been subjected to panhandling,foul language,insults and drunken or drug induced bad behavior by some of the homeless scumbags there. Other than that you are right, the parks are GREAT and play equipment needs to be maintained properly.

  124. Anonymous

    DPD,
    No one commented on your statement regarding the Parks. I too think the Parks in Davis are fantastic for kids and adults. However there is one exception, Central Park.
    On the few ocassions I have taken my children there we have been subjected to panhandling,foul language,insults and drunken or drug induced bad behavior by some of the homeless scumbags there. Other than that you are right, the parks are GREAT and play equipment needs to be maintained properly.

  125. 無名 - wu ming

    a coop annex would be fantastic, but i suspect that they wouldn’t do it, given the degree to which they already extended themselves with the remodeling of the G st. store.

    still, if they were considering it, i’d be ecstatic.

  126. 無名 - wu ming

    a coop annex would be fantastic, but i suspect that they wouldn’t do it, given the degree to which they already extended themselves with the remodeling of the G st. store.

    still, if they were considering it, i’d be ecstatic.

  127. 無名 - wu ming

    a coop annex would be fantastic, but i suspect that they wouldn’t do it, given the degree to which they already extended themselves with the remodeling of the G st. store.

    still, if they were considering it, i’d be ecstatic.

  128. 無名 - wu ming

    a coop annex would be fantastic, but i suspect that they wouldn’t do it, given the degree to which they already extended themselves with the remodeling of the G st. store.

    still, if they were considering it, i’d be ecstatic.

  129. popsicle mall

    a co-op annex is a bad idea. sorry, it just is. the main co-op store has been a mess even before the remodel began. there is not a clear vision for the future of the food co-op right now so it is best left to regroup a bit. the co-op deli is absolutely horrible and they missed the boat on Salad Bars and Juice Bars big time after the last remodel. Nugget has been siphoning business off the co-op like a huge leach. The co-op will be lucky if they can attract anybody with a new deli / salad bar / juice bar. they really missed the boat years ago.

    as far as westlake, don’t know what to tell you. davis manor has been vacant for years until the dollar store, and Albertsons served that whole neighborhood very well until the grocery wars. my guess is more people walk in that ‘hood than in west davis so it makes more sense from a business standpoint to put something there. westlake will have to wait a few years more i’d guess before an answer appears.

  130. popsicle mall

    a co-op annex is a bad idea. sorry, it just is. the main co-op store has been a mess even before the remodel began. there is not a clear vision for the future of the food co-op right now so it is best left to regroup a bit. the co-op deli is absolutely horrible and they missed the boat on Salad Bars and Juice Bars big time after the last remodel. Nugget has been siphoning business off the co-op like a huge leach. The co-op will be lucky if they can attract anybody with a new deli / salad bar / juice bar. they really missed the boat years ago.

    as far as westlake, don’t know what to tell you. davis manor has been vacant for years until the dollar store, and Albertsons served that whole neighborhood very well until the grocery wars. my guess is more people walk in that ‘hood than in west davis so it makes more sense from a business standpoint to put something there. westlake will have to wait a few years more i’d guess before an answer appears.

  131. popsicle mall

    a co-op annex is a bad idea. sorry, it just is. the main co-op store has been a mess even before the remodel began. there is not a clear vision for the future of the food co-op right now so it is best left to regroup a bit. the co-op deli is absolutely horrible and they missed the boat on Salad Bars and Juice Bars big time after the last remodel. Nugget has been siphoning business off the co-op like a huge leach. The co-op will be lucky if they can attract anybody with a new deli / salad bar / juice bar. they really missed the boat years ago.

    as far as westlake, don’t know what to tell you. davis manor has been vacant for years until the dollar store, and Albertsons served that whole neighborhood very well until the grocery wars. my guess is more people walk in that ‘hood than in west davis so it makes more sense from a business standpoint to put something there. westlake will have to wait a few years more i’d guess before an answer appears.

  132. popsicle mall

    a co-op annex is a bad idea. sorry, it just is. the main co-op store has been a mess even before the remodel began. there is not a clear vision for the future of the food co-op right now so it is best left to regroup a bit. the co-op deli is absolutely horrible and they missed the boat on Salad Bars and Juice Bars big time after the last remodel. Nugget has been siphoning business off the co-op like a huge leach. The co-op will be lucky if they can attract anybody with a new deli / salad bar / juice bar. they really missed the boat years ago.

    as far as westlake, don’t know what to tell you. davis manor has been vacant for years until the dollar store, and Albertsons served that whole neighborhood very well until the grocery wars. my guess is more people walk in that ‘hood than in west davis so it makes more sense from a business standpoint to put something there. westlake will have to wait a few years more i’d guess before an answer appears.

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