A Budget That Nobody Wants–And We’re Probably Stuck With

Despite a veto from the Governor, this is likely going to be the budget. The legislature expects to override the Governor’s Veto this is coming on Friday. If that happens, California will finally have a budget. The Governor will shown to be a powerless figure who occupies the statehouse of the nation’s largest state.

As the Bee Editorial says:

“Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger will reclaim the high ground on the issue that propelled him into the Governor’s Office five years ago but has bedeviled him ever since: the state’s badly broken finances.”

Of course it’s hard to feel for this governor after some of the antics he has pulled including threatening the livelihood of tens of thousands of state employees, laying off thousands of temporary state employees, and now threatening to have a temper-tantrum and veto every bill that comes before his desk.

Polling shows that Governor Schwarzenegger is at an all-time low in his approval, but most of the public does not have the stomach for recall. Heck, recall did not work last time and it will not work this time.

No one is really happy about the budget.

Jim Sanders of the Sacramento Bee on Monday reported:

“A key element of the deal would increase by 10 percent the amount of income taxes withheld from workers, and from taxpayers who earn income from investments.

Much of the $15.2 billion budget shortfall would be bridged by advancing revenues to be collected in future years, shifting or borrowing money from other state funds and employing accounting maneuvers. The plan would generate immediate revenue but leave gaping holes in future budgets.”

Dan Walters, who I rarely agree with, blasted the budget deal:

“Nobody could have dreamed up a less responsible, more gimmicky, sure-to-backfire state budget than the one California’s political leaders cobbled together and were jamming through the Legislature on Monday night to end a months-long stalemate…

“They violated every principle of fiscal responsibility by conjuring up billions of dollars in sham revenues – basically money borrowed from corporate and personal taxpayers that would have to be paid back later – to cover a huge deficit so they could blow town.”

Assemblywoman Lois Wolk’s comments were surprisingly and refreshingly honest.

“The best you can say about this budget is that it’s done. We have managed to keep our schools funded without raiding funds from local government and transportation. That’s good.

“The disappointing part is that we have only, as the Governor says, kicked the can further down the road. We failed to address the structural deficit and next year’s budget will be even more difficult to solve than this one. Yes, this is a compromise, but it’s not one that anyone should be especially proud of. I’m not.

“On the plus side, in addition to avoiding teacher layoffs, I am satisfied that we were able to keep our local law enforcement and rural sheriffs fully funded and prevented some of the most onerous cuts in health services for children and seniors.

“This experience has reinforced my belief that we need to reform the budget process as soon as possible. Allowing a minority of legislators to hold the Governor and the entire state hostage is unacceptable. I am currently working with an independent bipartisan reform effort going on right now called California Forward. This is the most serious reform effort in decades and I am looking forward to supporting their recommendations.”

On the other hand, what has the Assemblywoman done to change the outcome? She voted for the compromise.

Basically what the legislature is doing is kicking the can down the road to the next legislative session. They have not done anything to solve the problems that underlie the budget. Schools will face budget cuts again next year. Worker’s will face uncertainty about their job security and their benefits. Millions still have no health insurance.

One thing this whole mess has convinced me to do is take another look at the redistricting reform bill. Personally, I think term limits have been a disaster. As this process unfolded, it was clear that there was no big five who could get together and hammer out the details of the budget and then get their members to support it. It was also clear that Governor has absolutely no influence in his party. Some might say that’s a good thing, but the problem with it is that he cannot get the membership of his party to agree to his proposals. That leaves the Republican party with the power only to hijack and to negotiate and bargain.

Why might the redistricting plan help? For starters we can hold politicians accountable. Right now, 90 percent of the legislators live in safe districts. It is difficult to hold politicians accountable when they do that, except in the rare condition when one of their own party members can take them out like what happened with Mark Leno defeating Carole Migden.

If you look at the groups supporting Prop 11 there are some pretty good reformist groups on the list–League of Women Voters, AARP, Common Cause, ACLU, advocates from blacks, Hispanics, children, and seniors, among others from the other side which includes Chamber of Commerce, Police Chiefs Association, Taxpayers’ Association, Business Roundtable, the list goes on.

I have not decided to support the measure, but I am looking again. Some have suggested that the two-thirds vote is a problem–it is but it is not going to go away. The only way this gets solved rather than postured is if both sides go into negotiations and recognize that they have to do things that they do not want. For Republicans that means some taxes have to go up, perhaps they can decide which ones. For Democrats that means there has to be cuts. If you do not want education cut–and they should not–then you have to find some cuts.

If I were they, I would appoint a six member bipartisan group of legislators at the beginning of the session to come up with a way to reform the system and avoid this trouble from the start. Go through the budget and figure out what can be cut and then agree on revenue enhancements. When both sides hate it, then you know that there has been a good job done. Until that happens, we are going to keep repeating this year’s scenario.

The worst part is that the people who get caught in this are not the legislators. Last night on the news they showed all of these state funded senior housing care centers where people have had to borrow from their own savings in order to keep them afloat. If these centers go under, thousands of senior could be put on the street. That would look good right before an election.

—Doug Paul Davis reporting

About The Author

David Greenwald is the founder, editor, and executive director of the Davis Vanguard. He founded the Vanguard in 2006. David Greenwald moved to Davis in 1996 to attend Graduate School at UC Davis in Political Science. He lives in South Davis with his wife Cecilia Escamilla Greenwald and three children.

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120 Comments

  1. Anonymous

    You are right. This is an ugly budget; however, I hope the legislature overrides the Governor’s veto and gets us going again — pronto. As a state employee I know how hard this stalemate has hit individuals, organizations, and businesses that can least afford it. Shame on them. But enough. Pass the darn thing.

  2. Anonymous

    You are right. This is an ugly budget; however, I hope the legislature overrides the Governor’s veto and gets us going again — pronto. As a state employee I know how hard this stalemate has hit individuals, organizations, and businesses that can least afford it. Shame on them. But enough. Pass the darn thing.

  3. Anonymous

    You are right. This is an ugly budget; however, I hope the legislature overrides the Governor’s veto and gets us going again — pronto. As a state employee I know how hard this stalemate has hit individuals, organizations, and businesses that can least afford it. Shame on them. But enough. Pass the darn thing.

  4. Anonymous

    You are right. This is an ugly budget; however, I hope the legislature overrides the Governor’s veto and gets us going again — pronto. As a state employee I know how hard this stalemate has hit individuals, organizations, and businesses that can least afford it. Shame on them. But enough. Pass the darn thing.

  5. davisite

    Mariko Yamada’s primary campaign position that the budget should be passed with a plurality of 60% rather than the current 67% would be a good beginning and could probably get the support of CA voters, especially if some sort of small temporary tax reduction was included in the initiative to sweeten the deal.

  6. davisite

    Mariko Yamada’s primary campaign position that the budget should be passed with a plurality of 60% rather than the current 67% would be a good beginning and could probably get the support of CA voters, especially if some sort of small temporary tax reduction was included in the initiative to sweeten the deal.

  7. davisite

    Mariko Yamada’s primary campaign position that the budget should be passed with a plurality of 60% rather than the current 67% would be a good beginning and could probably get the support of CA voters, especially if some sort of small temporary tax reduction was included in the initiative to sweeten the deal.

  8. davisite

    Mariko Yamada’s primary campaign position that the budget should be passed with a plurality of 60% rather than the current 67% would be a good beginning and could probably get the support of CA voters, especially if some sort of small temporary tax reduction was included in the initiative to sweeten the deal.

  9. East Coaster

    “If you do not want education cut–and they should not–then you have to find some cuts. If I were they, I would appoint a six member bipartisan group of legislators at the beginning of the session to come up with a way to reform the system and avoid this trouble from the start. Go through the budget and figure out what can be cut and then agree on revenue enhancements. When both sides hate it, then you know that there has been a good job done. Until that happens, we are going to keep repeating this year’s scenario.”

    Education funding cuts is the first place to begin. More than 50% of the budget is spent on education. There was a nine part piece in the Sac Bee some years ago about the huge grants being given away to certain school districts that asked for them – w NO ACCOUNTABILITY. And I mean NONE! There is huge bloat when millions are given away to the LA School District, yet no follow-up to determine if the money is being used wisely and having any appreciable positive impact. The Sac Bee thought so too.

    Nothing should be sacred when it comes to budget cuts. The fact of the matter is, this state has been held hostage by two unions – Teachers and Prison Guards. These two unions are a good part of the reason the state is in the mess it is. Had Teachers Unions not pressed for these giveaway/runaway grants, a huge chunk of money would have been available for the basics and a reserve fund for tough times.

    The governor is right to veto the budget, even if the gesture is futile. It sends a message that he was not responsible for the budget mess, the current legislature is. So when next year rolls around, the current legislature only has themselves to blame and no one else when things go sour again – and they will. I don’t care for our current governor, but he is right on this one. Only if he holds the current legislature accountable in some way, will there by any hope of reform. And reform is absolutely necessary – spending has run amok in CA. Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.

  10. East Coaster

    “If you do not want education cut–and they should not–then you have to find some cuts. If I were they, I would appoint a six member bipartisan group of legislators at the beginning of the session to come up with a way to reform the system and avoid this trouble from the start. Go through the budget and figure out what can be cut and then agree on revenue enhancements. When both sides hate it, then you know that there has been a good job done. Until that happens, we are going to keep repeating this year’s scenario.”

    Education funding cuts is the first place to begin. More than 50% of the budget is spent on education. There was a nine part piece in the Sac Bee some years ago about the huge grants being given away to certain school districts that asked for them – w NO ACCOUNTABILITY. And I mean NONE! There is huge bloat when millions are given away to the LA School District, yet no follow-up to determine if the money is being used wisely and having any appreciable positive impact. The Sac Bee thought so too.

    Nothing should be sacred when it comes to budget cuts. The fact of the matter is, this state has been held hostage by two unions – Teachers and Prison Guards. These two unions are a good part of the reason the state is in the mess it is. Had Teachers Unions not pressed for these giveaway/runaway grants, a huge chunk of money would have been available for the basics and a reserve fund for tough times.

    The governor is right to veto the budget, even if the gesture is futile. It sends a message that he was not responsible for the budget mess, the current legislature is. So when next year rolls around, the current legislature only has themselves to blame and no one else when things go sour again – and they will. I don’t care for our current governor, but he is right on this one. Only if he holds the current legislature accountable in some way, will there by any hope of reform. And reform is absolutely necessary – spending has run amok in CA. Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.

  11. East Coaster

    “If you do not want education cut–and they should not–then you have to find some cuts. If I were they, I would appoint a six member bipartisan group of legislators at the beginning of the session to come up with a way to reform the system and avoid this trouble from the start. Go through the budget and figure out what can be cut and then agree on revenue enhancements. When both sides hate it, then you know that there has been a good job done. Until that happens, we are going to keep repeating this year’s scenario.”

    Education funding cuts is the first place to begin. More than 50% of the budget is spent on education. There was a nine part piece in the Sac Bee some years ago about the huge grants being given away to certain school districts that asked for them – w NO ACCOUNTABILITY. And I mean NONE! There is huge bloat when millions are given away to the LA School District, yet no follow-up to determine if the money is being used wisely and having any appreciable positive impact. The Sac Bee thought so too.

    Nothing should be sacred when it comes to budget cuts. The fact of the matter is, this state has been held hostage by two unions – Teachers and Prison Guards. These two unions are a good part of the reason the state is in the mess it is. Had Teachers Unions not pressed for these giveaway/runaway grants, a huge chunk of money would have been available for the basics and a reserve fund for tough times.

    The governor is right to veto the budget, even if the gesture is futile. It sends a message that he was not responsible for the budget mess, the current legislature is. So when next year rolls around, the current legislature only has themselves to blame and no one else when things go sour again – and they will. I don’t care for our current governor, but he is right on this one. Only if he holds the current legislature accountable in some way, will there by any hope of reform. And reform is absolutely necessary – spending has run amok in CA. Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.

  12. East Coaster

    “If you do not want education cut–and they should not–then you have to find some cuts. If I were they, I would appoint a six member bipartisan group of legislators at the beginning of the session to come up with a way to reform the system and avoid this trouble from the start. Go through the budget and figure out what can be cut and then agree on revenue enhancements. When both sides hate it, then you know that there has been a good job done. Until that happens, we are going to keep repeating this year’s scenario.”

    Education funding cuts is the first place to begin. More than 50% of the budget is spent on education. There was a nine part piece in the Sac Bee some years ago about the huge grants being given away to certain school districts that asked for them – w NO ACCOUNTABILITY. And I mean NONE! There is huge bloat when millions are given away to the LA School District, yet no follow-up to determine if the money is being used wisely and having any appreciable positive impact. The Sac Bee thought so too.

    Nothing should be sacred when it comes to budget cuts. The fact of the matter is, this state has been held hostage by two unions – Teachers and Prison Guards. These two unions are a good part of the reason the state is in the mess it is. Had Teachers Unions not pressed for these giveaway/runaway grants, a huge chunk of money would have been available for the basics and a reserve fund for tough times.

    The governor is right to veto the budget, even if the gesture is futile. It sends a message that he was not responsible for the budget mess, the current legislature is. So when next year rolls around, the current legislature only has themselves to blame and no one else when things go sour again – and they will. I don’t care for our current governor, but he is right on this one. Only if he holds the current legislature accountable in some way, will there by any hope of reform. And reform is absolutely necessary – spending has run amok in CA. Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.

  13. Anonymous

    “Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.”

    Really?!? I’m also from the East Coast, and I think k-12 education spending out here is pitifully inadequate.

  14. Anonymous

    “Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.”

    Really?!? I’m also from the East Coast, and I think k-12 education spending out here is pitifully inadequate.

  15. Anonymous

    “Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.”

    Really?!? I’m also from the East Coast, and I think k-12 education spending out here is pitifully inadequate.

  16. Anonymous

    “Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.”

    Really?!? I’m also from the East Coast, and I think k-12 education spending out here is pitifully inadequate.

  17. Anonymous

    “Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.”

    California spends FAR less per student on education than most eastern states do (and by the way I’m also from the East). According to the NY Times, New York spends over $14,000 per student; California is less than half of that.

  18. Anonymous

    “Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.”

    California spends FAR less per student on education than most eastern states do (and by the way I’m also from the East). According to the NY Times, New York spends over $14,000 per student; California is less than half of that.

  19. Anonymous

    “Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.”

    California spends FAR less per student on education than most eastern states do (and by the way I’m also from the East). According to the NY Times, New York spends over $14,000 per student; California is less than half of that.

  20. Anonymous

    “Trust me, I’m from the East Coast, and the expenditures out here are ridiculous.”

    California spends FAR less per student on education than most eastern states do (and by the way I’m also from the East). According to the NY Times, New York spends over $14,000 per student; California is less than half of that.

  21. Doug Paul Davis

    One of the problems with the point from East Coaster is that education cuts punish the wrong people in two ways. First, it punishes the kids not the adults. Second, it punishes those school districts that have eliminated bloat while enable those who have not to survive by cutting theirs. As a result the cut to education that was to occur this year would have been devastating to a district like Davis that was going to have make severe cut backs.

  22. Doug Paul Davis

    One of the problems with the point from East Coaster is that education cuts punish the wrong people in two ways. First, it punishes the kids not the adults. Second, it punishes those school districts that have eliminated bloat while enable those who have not to survive by cutting theirs. As a result the cut to education that was to occur this year would have been devastating to a district like Davis that was going to have make severe cut backs.

  23. Doug Paul Davis

    One of the problems with the point from East Coaster is that education cuts punish the wrong people in two ways. First, it punishes the kids not the adults. Second, it punishes those school districts that have eliminated bloat while enable those who have not to survive by cutting theirs. As a result the cut to education that was to occur this year would have been devastating to a district like Davis that was going to have make severe cut backs.

  24. Doug Paul Davis

    One of the problems with the point from East Coaster is that education cuts punish the wrong people in two ways. First, it punishes the kids not the adults. Second, it punishes those school districts that have eliminated bloat while enable those who have not to survive by cutting theirs. As a result the cut to education that was to occur this year would have been devastating to a district like Davis that was going to have make severe cut backs.

  25. wdf

    I don’t know the original source, but a quick and dirty look at wikipedia shows that California ranks 16th in the measure of taxes as a percentage of per capita income.

    Note that Hawaii, Alaska, New Mexico, and Utah rank higher than California. I believe Alaska (top of the chart) gets much of its tax revenue from oil production (oil companies) rather than directly taxing individuals.

    East coast states above California on the list are Maine, Massachussets, Delaware, New York, Connecticutt, Rhode Island, and New Jersey. Other states are east of the Mississippi — Ohio, Kentucky, West Virginia, Wisconsin.

    California doesn’t look anomalous compared to the East Coast.

  26. wdf

    I don’t know the original source, but a quick and dirty look at wikipedia shows that California ranks 16th in the measure of taxes as a percentage of per capita income.

    Note that Hawaii, Alaska, New Mexico, and Utah rank higher than California. I believe Alaska (top of the chart) gets much of its tax revenue from oil production (oil companies) rather than directly taxing individuals.

    East coast states above California on the list are Maine, Massachussets, Delaware, New York, Connecticutt, Rhode Island, and New Jersey. Other states are east of the Mississippi — Ohio, Kentucky, West Virginia, Wisconsin.

    California doesn’t look anomalous compared to the East Coast.

  27. wdf

    I don’t know the original source, but a quick and dirty look at wikipedia shows that California ranks 16th in the measure of taxes as a percentage of per capita income.

    Note that Hawaii, Alaska, New Mexico, and Utah rank higher than California. I believe Alaska (top of the chart) gets much of its tax revenue from oil production (oil companies) rather than directly taxing individuals.

    East coast states above California on the list are Maine, Massachussets, Delaware, New York, Connecticutt, Rhode Island, and New Jersey. Other states are east of the Mississippi — Ohio, Kentucky, West Virginia, Wisconsin.

    California doesn’t look anomalous compared to the East Coast.

  28. wdf

    I don’t know the original source, but a quick and dirty look at wikipedia shows that California ranks 16th in the measure of taxes as a percentage of per capita income.

    Note that Hawaii, Alaska, New Mexico, and Utah rank higher than California. I believe Alaska (top of the chart) gets much of its tax revenue from oil production (oil companies) rather than directly taxing individuals.

    East coast states above California on the list are Maine, Massachussets, Delaware, New York, Connecticutt, Rhode Island, and New Jersey. Other states are east of the Mississippi — Ohio, Kentucky, West Virginia, Wisconsin.

    California doesn’t look anomalous compared to the East Coast.

  29. FastFwed

    Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.

  30. FastFwed

    Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.

  31. FastFwed

    Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.

  32. FastFwed

    Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.

  33. Anonymous

    davisite at 808am: You are very, very wrong and once you reduce the # to 60% it will NEVER go back to the 2/3. Count on that. We’ll have state budgets approved on time but w/ plenty of tax increases on top of that. Remember the “good ol’ days” before Prop 13? They were good ol’ days if you got to figure out property tax rates AFTER you had spent the money!

  34. Anonymous

    davisite at 808am: You are very, very wrong and once you reduce the # to 60% it will NEVER go back to the 2/3. Count on that. We’ll have state budgets approved on time but w/ plenty of tax increases on top of that. Remember the “good ol’ days” before Prop 13? They were good ol’ days if you got to figure out property tax rates AFTER you had spent the money!

  35. Anonymous

    davisite at 808am: You are very, very wrong and once you reduce the # to 60% it will NEVER go back to the 2/3. Count on that. We’ll have state budgets approved on time but w/ plenty of tax increases on top of that. Remember the “good ol’ days” before Prop 13? They were good ol’ days if you got to figure out property tax rates AFTER you had spent the money!

  36. Anonymous

    davisite at 808am: You are very, very wrong and once you reduce the # to 60% it will NEVER go back to the 2/3. Count on that. We’ll have state budgets approved on time but w/ plenty of tax increases on top of that. Remember the “good ol’ days” before Prop 13? They were good ol’ days if you got to figure out property tax rates AFTER you had spent the money!

  37. Doug Paul Davis

    FWD: If only it were that easy, unfortunately any amount a single individual could donate would hardly be a drop in the bucket.

    Anonymous: I don’t believe that Davisite said the requirement would go back to 67% nor should it.

  38. Doug Paul Davis

    FWD: If only it were that easy, unfortunately any amount a single individual could donate would hardly be a drop in the bucket.

    Anonymous: I don’t believe that Davisite said the requirement would go back to 67% nor should it.

  39. Doug Paul Davis

    FWD: If only it were that easy, unfortunately any amount a single individual could donate would hardly be a drop in the bucket.

    Anonymous: I don’t believe that Davisite said the requirement would go back to 67% nor should it.

  40. Doug Paul Davis

    FWD: If only it were that easy, unfortunately any amount a single individual could donate would hardly be a drop in the bucket.

    Anonymous: I don’t believe that Davisite said the requirement would go back to 67% nor should it.

  41. per pupil spending

    According to the US Dept of Ed, per-pupil spending by state:
    table is at
    http://nces.ed.gov/programs/
    digest/d07/tables/dt07_174.asp

    CA: $7,905
    US average: $8,701

    some selected east coast states:
    MA: $11,642
    VT: $11,972
    NY: $13,703
    MD: $10,031
    VA: $8,886

    There are a few states lower than CA, but it is definitely below average.

  42. per pupil spending

    According to the US Dept of Ed, per-pupil spending by state:
    table is at
    http://nces.ed.gov/programs/
    digest/d07/tables/dt07_174.asp

    CA: $7,905
    US average: $8,701

    some selected east coast states:
    MA: $11,642
    VT: $11,972
    NY: $13,703
    MD: $10,031
    VA: $8,886

    There are a few states lower than CA, but it is definitely below average.

  43. per pupil spending

    According to the US Dept of Ed, per-pupil spending by state:
    table is at
    http://nces.ed.gov/programs/
    digest/d07/tables/dt07_174.asp

    CA: $7,905
    US average: $8,701

    some selected east coast states:
    MA: $11,642
    VT: $11,972
    NY: $13,703
    MD: $10,031
    VA: $8,886

    There are a few states lower than CA, but it is definitely below average.

  44. per pupil spending

    According to the US Dept of Ed, per-pupil spending by state:
    table is at
    http://nces.ed.gov/programs/
    digest/d07/tables/dt07_174.asp

    CA: $7,905
    US average: $8,701

    some selected east coast states:
    MA: $11,642
    VT: $11,972
    NY: $13,703
    MD: $10,031
    VA: $8,886

    There are a few states lower than CA, but it is definitely below average.

  45. wdf

    Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.

    Hi, Fred,

    I know that California isn’t near the bottom in education spending, but everything I have read and researched indicates that California is below the national average in per pupil spending.

    See “per pupil spending” above, for instance.

    And that may or may not account for cost of living, as DPD mentions.

    Could you please provide a link to the Dan Walters piece that offers the more positive framework on the issue?

  46. wdf

    Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.

    Hi, Fred,

    I know that California isn’t near the bottom in education spending, but everything I have read and researched indicates that California is below the national average in per pupil spending.

    See “per pupil spending” above, for instance.

    And that may or may not account for cost of living, as DPD mentions.

    Could you please provide a link to the Dan Walters piece that offers the more positive framework on the issue?

  47. wdf

    Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.

    Hi, Fred,

    I know that California isn’t near the bottom in education spending, but everything I have read and researched indicates that California is below the national average in per pupil spending.

    See “per pupil spending” above, for instance.

    And that may or may not account for cost of living, as DPD mentions.

    Could you please provide a link to the Dan Walters piece that offers the more positive framework on the issue?

  48. wdf

    Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.

    Hi, Fred,

    I know that California isn’t near the bottom in education spending, but everything I have read and researched indicates that California is below the national average in per pupil spending.

    See “per pupil spending” above, for instance.

    And that may or may not account for cost of living, as DPD mentions.

    Could you please provide a link to the Dan Walters piece that offers the more positive framework on the issue?

  49. Anonymous

    “Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.”

    So what’s your point?

    Education is perfectly fine and we’re just a nation of whiners?

    That if parents want a good education for their kids, then they can damn well pay for it?

  50. Anonymous

    “Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.”

    So what’s your point?

    Education is perfectly fine and we’re just a nation of whiners?

    That if parents want a good education for their kids, then they can damn well pay for it?

  51. Anonymous

    “Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.”

    So what’s your point?

    Education is perfectly fine and we’re just a nation of whiners?

    That if parents want a good education for their kids, then they can damn well pay for it?

  52. Anonymous

    “Dan Walters, w/ the Sacto Bee had the relevant numbers regarding how much we spend per pupil here in CA. Once and for all people, please READ it and remember it so we can get over this nonsense that we are near the bottom of the 50 states in education spending. I don’t know HOW some of you function carrying around all the guilt for having some money of your own! If you have too much, just cut a check to the city/county or state and they’ll take it off your hands.”

    So what’s your point?

    Education is perfectly fine and we’re just a nation of whiners?

    That if parents want a good education for their kids, then they can damn well pay for it?

  53. davisite

    Anon 10:23
    “davisite at 808am: You are very, very wrong and once you reduce the # to 60% it will NEVER go back to the 2/3. Count on that”

    THAT’s fine with me. 60% seems a good compromise between the present 2/3(which gives just a few legislators veto-power) and a simple 50%+1 which can be abused by the simple majority.

  54. davisite

    Anon 10:23
    “davisite at 808am: You are very, very wrong and once you reduce the # to 60% it will NEVER go back to the 2/3. Count on that”

    THAT’s fine with me. 60% seems a good compromise between the present 2/3(which gives just a few legislators veto-power) and a simple 50%+1 which can be abused by the simple majority.

  55. davisite

    Anon 10:23
    “davisite at 808am: You are very, very wrong and once you reduce the # to 60% it will NEVER go back to the 2/3. Count on that”

    THAT’s fine with me. 60% seems a good compromise between the present 2/3(which gives just a few legislators veto-power) and a simple 50%+1 which can be abused by the simple majority.

  56. davisite

    Anon 10:23
    “davisite at 808am: You are very, very wrong and once you reduce the # to 60% it will NEVER go back to the 2/3. Count on that”

    THAT’s fine with me. 60% seems a good compromise between the present 2/3(which gives just a few legislators veto-power) and a simple 50%+1 which can be abused by the simple majority.

  57. wdf

    John Mockler is a former Executive Director for the California State Board of Education, and former interim Secretary of Education for the State of California.

    There is an interesting case that he makes on the argument of whether California is getting its money’s worth or not in education. It is at this link.

  58. wdf

    John Mockler is a former Executive Director for the California State Board of Education, and former interim Secretary of Education for the State of California.

    There is an interesting case that he makes on the argument of whether California is getting its money’s worth or not in education. It is at this link.

  59. wdf

    John Mockler is a former Executive Director for the California State Board of Education, and former interim Secretary of Education for the State of California.

    There is an interesting case that he makes on the argument of whether California is getting its money’s worth or not in education. It is at this link.

  60. wdf

    John Mockler is a former Executive Director for the California State Board of Education, and former interim Secretary of Education for the State of California.

    There is an interesting case that he makes on the argument of whether California is getting its money’s worth or not in education. It is at this link.

  61. Anonymous

    First thing the state needs to do is audit its employees. I realize that there are the ones that work hard, but you have to admit, there are just as many, if not more, that just “suck” our tax dollars. When I hear things from a state employee such as, “I’m beyond my probation period, now I’m untouchable,” it leads me to believe that there are many more just like him. Bring in the “Bobs” (see Office Space) and let’s start trimming the fat where there’s plenty of it.

  62. Anonymous

    First thing the state needs to do is audit its employees. I realize that there are the ones that work hard, but you have to admit, there are just as many, if not more, that just “suck” our tax dollars. When I hear things from a state employee such as, “I’m beyond my probation period, now I’m untouchable,” it leads me to believe that there are many more just like him. Bring in the “Bobs” (see Office Space) and let’s start trimming the fat where there’s plenty of it.

  63. Anonymous

    First thing the state needs to do is audit its employees. I realize that there are the ones that work hard, but you have to admit, there are just as many, if not more, that just “suck” our tax dollars. When I hear things from a state employee such as, “I’m beyond my probation period, now I’m untouchable,” it leads me to believe that there are many more just like him. Bring in the “Bobs” (see Office Space) and let’s start trimming the fat where there’s plenty of it.

  64. Anonymous

    First thing the state needs to do is audit its employees. I realize that there are the ones that work hard, but you have to admit, there are just as many, if not more, that just “suck” our tax dollars. When I hear things from a state employee such as, “I’m beyond my probation period, now I’m untouchable,” it leads me to believe that there are many more just like him. Bring in the “Bobs” (see Office Space) and let’s start trimming the fat where there’s plenty of it.

  65. state employee in Davis

    Nobody in state service is untouchable. I have two colleagues with great records who have been with the state for over 15 and 20 years respectively and they have new bosses who are out to get them.

    They said they belong to the union and are happy to have someone fighting for them. You never know when a new boss will arrive who has a point to prove. With the recent budget our department has seen a lot of changes.

    I wish we could pass a state budget with a simple majority. It’s time to change the law.

  66. state employee in Davis

    Nobody in state service is untouchable. I have two colleagues with great records who have been with the state for over 15 and 20 years respectively and they have new bosses who are out to get them.

    They said they belong to the union and are happy to have someone fighting for them. You never know when a new boss will arrive who has a point to prove. With the recent budget our department has seen a lot of changes.

    I wish we could pass a state budget with a simple majority. It’s time to change the law.

  67. state employee in Davis

    Nobody in state service is untouchable. I have two colleagues with great records who have been with the state for over 15 and 20 years respectively and they have new bosses who are out to get them.

    They said they belong to the union and are happy to have someone fighting for them. You never know when a new boss will arrive who has a point to prove. With the recent budget our department has seen a lot of changes.

    I wish we could pass a state budget with a simple majority. It’s time to change the law.

  68. state employee in Davis

    Nobody in state service is untouchable. I have two colleagues with great records who have been with the state for over 15 and 20 years respectively and they have new bosses who are out to get them.

    They said they belong to the union and are happy to have someone fighting for them. You never know when a new boss will arrive who has a point to prove. With the recent budget our department has seen a lot of changes.

    I wish we could pass a state budget with a simple majority. It’s time to change the law.

  69. Anonymous

    “let’s start trimming the fat”

    I’ve been learning, after at least 3 decades of being a government and political watcher, that government fat is about as certain as enemy weapons of mass destruction.

    Much of that supposed fat ends up being real services cut — for instance, health care for uninsured kids.

  70. Anonymous

    “let’s start trimming the fat”

    I’ve been learning, after at least 3 decades of being a government and political watcher, that government fat is about as certain as enemy weapons of mass destruction.

    Much of that supposed fat ends up being real services cut — for instance, health care for uninsured kids.

  71. Anonymous

    “let’s start trimming the fat”

    I’ve been learning, after at least 3 decades of being a government and political watcher, that government fat is about as certain as enemy weapons of mass destruction.

    Much of that supposed fat ends up being real services cut — for instance, health care for uninsured kids.

  72. Anonymous

    “let’s start trimming the fat”

    I’ve been learning, after at least 3 decades of being a government and political watcher, that government fat is about as certain as enemy weapons of mass destruction.

    Much of that supposed fat ends up being real services cut — for instance, health care for uninsured kids.

  73. Anonymous

    Wow, so many things here. Unions? There are about 8 or 9 different unions in the University system in california. When that idiot grey davis signed the fair share bill he screwed tens of thousands of people into the unions. They are now forced to pay the union vampires whether they want to or not.
    In contrast to the statement about 2 employee’s “happy to have a union to fight for them”, I can point to a few hundred who say the unions do nothing except take their money illegally and when they call for help there is no return call and if there is, little or no help is given. The unions of the uc campuses, with one or 2 individual exceptions, generally stink.

    I agree with davis greenwald that dan walters of the SacBee is a Monday morning quarterback and is usually clueless about what’s going on in the real world. But david and DannyBob Walters appear to have something in common, they both blame Governor Schwarzenegger for everything. I am waiting for DannyBob walters to blame the Gov. for his loss of hair, his obesity and his aging. As far as David Greenwald not caring for the Gov. it is probably just party lines and a very closed mind on the part of David Greenwald.

    School problems and budgets? The Calif. school averages about $8600.00 per student. Is there fat in the administration of the schools budget? Being on the front line of this issue I can give an emphatic, Yes there is, lots of it, starting with education upper echelon and unions.

    Finally,(this will include some stats from the SacBee, there is the U.S. and Mexican government. There are about 360,000 children of illegal immigrants in the Calif. school system. Multiply that nyumber by 8600 and you will see how many dollars that costs all of us because the U.S. and Mexican goverments do control our southern borders properly. And before you bleeding heart liberals out there start yelling, immigrant bashing, I am aware it is not the fault of the children, and yes they are here. It is the fault of both governments and the parents who violate the law by coming here illegally. Do not fool yourselves, it is a huge financial issue and only one portion of the entire financial burden this problem causes. Finally the budget that hopefull will stay vetoed, STINKS, along with those that wrote and support it. It’s time to bite the bullet.

  74. Anonymous

    Wow, so many things here. Unions? There are about 8 or 9 different unions in the University system in california. When that idiot grey davis signed the fair share bill he screwed tens of thousands of people into the unions. They are now forced to pay the union vampires whether they want to or not.
    In contrast to the statement about 2 employee’s “happy to have a union to fight for them”, I can point to a few hundred who say the unions do nothing except take their money illegally and when they call for help there is no return call and if there is, little or no help is given. The unions of the uc campuses, with one or 2 individual exceptions, generally stink.

    I agree with davis greenwald that dan walters of the SacBee is a Monday morning quarterback and is usually clueless about what’s going on in the real world. But david and DannyBob Walters appear to have something in common, they both blame Governor Schwarzenegger for everything. I am waiting for DannyBob walters to blame the Gov. for his loss of hair, his obesity and his aging. As far as David Greenwald not caring for the Gov. it is probably just party lines and a very closed mind on the part of David Greenwald.

    School problems and budgets? The Calif. school averages about $8600.00 per student. Is there fat in the administration of the schools budget? Being on the front line of this issue I can give an emphatic, Yes there is, lots of it, starting with education upper echelon and unions.

    Finally,(this will include some stats from the SacBee, there is the U.S. and Mexican government. There are about 360,000 children of illegal immigrants in the Calif. school system. Multiply that nyumber by 8600 and you will see how many dollars that costs all of us because the U.S. and Mexican goverments do control our southern borders properly. And before you bleeding heart liberals out there start yelling, immigrant bashing, I am aware it is not the fault of the children, and yes they are here. It is the fault of both governments and the parents who violate the law by coming here illegally. Do not fool yourselves, it is a huge financial issue and only one portion of the entire financial burden this problem causes. Finally the budget that hopefull will stay vetoed, STINKS, along with those that wrote and support it. It’s time to bite the bullet.

  75. Anonymous

    Wow, so many things here. Unions? There are about 8 or 9 different unions in the University system in california. When that idiot grey davis signed the fair share bill he screwed tens of thousands of people into the unions. They are now forced to pay the union vampires whether they want to or not.
    In contrast to the statement about 2 employee’s “happy to have a union to fight for them”, I can point to a few hundred who say the unions do nothing except take their money illegally and when they call for help there is no return call and if there is, little or no help is given. The unions of the uc campuses, with one or 2 individual exceptions, generally stink.

    I agree with davis greenwald that dan walters of the SacBee is a Monday morning quarterback and is usually clueless about what’s going on in the real world. But david and DannyBob Walters appear to have something in common, they both blame Governor Schwarzenegger for everything. I am waiting for DannyBob walters to blame the Gov. for his loss of hair, his obesity and his aging. As far as David Greenwald not caring for the Gov. it is probably just party lines and a very closed mind on the part of David Greenwald.

    School problems and budgets? The Calif. school averages about $8600.00 per student. Is there fat in the administration of the schools budget? Being on the front line of this issue I can give an emphatic, Yes there is, lots of it, starting with education upper echelon and unions.

    Finally,(this will include some stats from the SacBee, there is the U.S. and Mexican government. There are about 360,000 children of illegal immigrants in the Calif. school system. Multiply that nyumber by 8600 and you will see how many dollars that costs all of us because the U.S. and Mexican goverments do control our southern borders properly. And before you bleeding heart liberals out there start yelling, immigrant bashing, I am aware it is not the fault of the children, and yes they are here. It is the fault of both governments and the parents who violate the law by coming here illegally. Do not fool yourselves, it is a huge financial issue and only one portion of the entire financial burden this problem causes. Finally the budget that hopefull will stay vetoed, STINKS, along with those that wrote and support it. It’s time to bite the bullet.

  76. Anonymous

    Wow, so many things here. Unions? There are about 8 or 9 different unions in the University system in california. When that idiot grey davis signed the fair share bill he screwed tens of thousands of people into the unions. They are now forced to pay the union vampires whether they want to or not.
    In contrast to the statement about 2 employee’s “happy to have a union to fight for them”, I can point to a few hundred who say the unions do nothing except take their money illegally and when they call for help there is no return call and if there is, little or no help is given. The unions of the uc campuses, with one or 2 individual exceptions, generally stink.

    I agree with davis greenwald that dan walters of the SacBee is a Monday morning quarterback and is usually clueless about what’s going on in the real world. But david and DannyBob Walters appear to have something in common, they both blame Governor Schwarzenegger for everything. I am waiting for DannyBob walters to blame the Gov. for his loss of hair, his obesity and his aging. As far as David Greenwald not caring for the Gov. it is probably just party lines and a very closed mind on the part of David Greenwald.

    School problems and budgets? The Calif. school averages about $8600.00 per student. Is there fat in the administration of the schools budget? Being on the front line of this issue I can give an emphatic, Yes there is, lots of it, starting with education upper echelon and unions.

    Finally,(this will include some stats from the SacBee, there is the U.S. and Mexican government. There are about 360,000 children of illegal immigrants in the Calif. school system. Multiply that nyumber by 8600 and you will see how many dollars that costs all of us because the U.S. and Mexican goverments do control our southern borders properly. And before you bleeding heart liberals out there start yelling, immigrant bashing, I am aware it is not the fault of the children, and yes they are here. It is the fault of both governments and the parents who violate the law by coming here illegally. Do not fool yourselves, it is a huge financial issue and only one portion of the entire financial burden this problem causes. Finally the budget that hopefull will stay vetoed, STINKS, along with those that wrote and support it. It’s time to bite the bullet.

  77. Mike Adams

    Personal Rant –

    What happened to social values in this country beyond “my, me, mine”? Being a good citizen means more than saying you support those forced into the poverty draft in Iraq – it means caring about your fellow citizens as well. Don’t get me wrong, I am all for accountability, for unions, government (including schools), corporations and individuals. But unions unlike corporations are democratic institutions. If you don’t like the way they are run then organize and change it. Is it easy? Hell no, like all institutions the people in power start bending the rules to protect personal interests rather than institutional goals. But that is inherent in social relations. By the way, democracy is about majority rule – I am tired of people worrying about an abusive majority. If you find yourself in the economic minority with above average income, be thankful, as I am. You shouldn’t get more power than anyone else to protect your interests. I don’t mind paying taxes when they go to helping folks rather than killing or caging them.

    FYI, given the demographics and global environment and economics, conditions in this country will get more challenging. Average age is rising and with that a dramatic increase in health care costs. Infrastructure improvements that have been put off for decades need to be addressed (this is one hidden cost of war and an excessive military). Economic adjustments due to changes in energy sources and global warming are going to be great.

    We will need to pull together, or sink separately.

    I think the costs of not having a budget at this time are too great to postpone. I understand the Governor’s frustration with this budget but I agree with Lois Wolk’s assessment. We need to move forward and use the existing situation to energize an immediate push to make structural changes.

    Reduce the percentage required to pass a budget.
    Reexamine redistricting.
    Push for greater accountability in all areas, including education.
    Our social use of prisons as a “solution” is way too costly – we need a long term plan to reduce crime and recidivism.
    Work for a single payer health care plan.
    Increase personal responsibility to participate in our democratic institutions – including unions.
    Make sure large corporations, who profit from education and infrastructure, are paying their real costs.
    Encourage innovation and small business, which contributes most to employment growth.
    Promote values and participation beyond consumerism. Reduce the growth in the federal military industrial complex (a tall order).

    I realize that the society I live in is a major determinant of my quality of life. To me, having a better educated, healthier, productive population participating in our country is more important than the car I drive (I may opt for a bike!), or the square footage of my house.

    And if anyone reads to the bottom of this – thanks.

  78. Mike Adams

    Personal Rant –

    What happened to social values in this country beyond “my, me, mine”? Being a good citizen means more than saying you support those forced into the poverty draft in Iraq – it means caring about your fellow citizens as well. Don’t get me wrong, I am all for accountability, for unions, government (including schools), corporations and individuals. But unions unlike corporations are democratic institutions. If you don’t like the way they are run then organize and change it. Is it easy? Hell no, like all institutions the people in power start bending the rules to protect personal interests rather than institutional goals. But that is inherent in social relations. By the way, democracy is about majority rule – I am tired of people worrying about an abusive majority. If you find yourself in the economic minority with above average income, be thankful, as I am. You shouldn’t get more power than anyone else to protect your interests. I don’t mind paying taxes when they go to helping folks rather than killing or caging them.

    FYI, given the demographics and global environment and economics, conditions in this country will get more challenging. Average age is rising and with that a dramatic increase in health care costs. Infrastructure improvements that have been put off for decades need to be addressed (this is one hidden cost of war and an excessive military). Economic adjustments due to changes in energy sources and global warming are going to be great.

    We will need to pull together, or sink separately.

    I think the costs of not having a budget at this time are too great to postpone. I understand the Governor’s frustration with this budget but I agree with Lois Wolk’s assessment. We need to move forward and use the existing situation to energize an immediate push to make structural changes.

    Reduce the percentage required to pass a budget.
    Reexamine redistricting.
    Push for greater accountability in all areas, including education.
    Our social use of prisons as a “solution” is way too costly – we need a long term plan to reduce crime and recidivism.
    Work for a single payer health care plan.
    Increase personal responsibility to participate in our democratic institutions – including unions.
    Make sure large corporations, who profit from education and infrastructure, are paying their real costs.
    Encourage innovation and small business, which contributes most to employment growth.
    Promote values and participation beyond consumerism. Reduce the growth in the federal military industrial complex (a tall order).

    I realize that the society I live in is a major determinant of my quality of life. To me, having a better educated, healthier, productive population participating in our country is more important than the car I drive (I may opt for a bike!), or the square footage of my house.

    And if anyone reads to the bottom of this – thanks.

  79. Mike Adams

    Personal Rant –

    What happened to social values in this country beyond “my, me, mine”? Being a good citizen means more than saying you support those forced into the poverty draft in Iraq – it means caring about your fellow citizens as well. Don’t get me wrong, I am all for accountability, for unions, government (including schools), corporations and individuals. But unions unlike corporations are democratic institutions. If you don’t like the way they are run then organize and change it. Is it easy? Hell no, like all institutions the people in power start bending the rules to protect personal interests rather than institutional goals. But that is inherent in social relations. By the way, democracy is about majority rule – I am tired of people worrying about an abusive majority. If you find yourself in the economic minority with above average income, be thankful, as I am. You shouldn’t get more power than anyone else to protect your interests. I don’t mind paying taxes when they go to helping folks rather than killing or caging them.

    FYI, given the demographics and global environment and economics, conditions in this country will get more challenging. Average age is rising and with that a dramatic increase in health care costs. Infrastructure improvements that have been put off for decades need to be addressed (this is one hidden cost of war and an excessive military). Economic adjustments due to changes in energy sources and global warming are going to be great.

    We will need to pull together, or sink separately.

    I think the costs of not having a budget at this time are too great to postpone. I understand the Governor’s frustration with this budget but I agree with Lois Wolk’s assessment. We need to move forward and use the existing situation to energize an immediate push to make structural changes.

    Reduce the percentage required to pass a budget.
    Reexamine redistricting.
    Push for greater accountability in all areas, including education.
    Our social use of prisons as a “solution” is way too costly – we need a long term plan to reduce crime and recidivism.
    Work for a single payer health care plan.
    Increase personal responsibility to participate in our democratic institutions – including unions.
    Make sure large corporations, who profit from education and infrastructure, are paying their real costs.
    Encourage innovation and small business, which contributes most to employment growth.
    Promote values and participation beyond consumerism. Reduce the growth in the federal military industrial complex (a tall order).

    I realize that the society I live in is a major determinant of my quality of life. To me, having a better educated, healthier, productive population participating in our country is more important than the car I drive (I may opt for a bike!), or the square footage of my house.

    And if anyone reads to the bottom of this – thanks.

  80. Mike Adams

    Personal Rant –

    What happened to social values in this country beyond “my, me, mine”? Being a good citizen means more than saying you support those forced into the poverty draft in Iraq – it means caring about your fellow citizens as well. Don’t get me wrong, I am all for accountability, for unions, government (including schools), corporations and individuals. But unions unlike corporations are democratic institutions. If you don’t like the way they are run then organize and change it. Is it easy? Hell no, like all institutions the people in power start bending the rules to protect personal interests rather than institutional goals. But that is inherent in social relations. By the way, democracy is about majority rule – I am tired of people worrying about an abusive majority. If you find yourself in the economic minority with above average income, be thankful, as I am. You shouldn’t get more power than anyone else to protect your interests. I don’t mind paying taxes when they go to helping folks rather than killing or caging them.

    FYI, given the demographics and global environment and economics, conditions in this country will get more challenging. Average age is rising and with that a dramatic increase in health care costs. Infrastructure improvements that have been put off for decades need to be addressed (this is one hidden cost of war and an excessive military). Economic adjustments due to changes in energy sources and global warming are going to be great.

    We will need to pull together, or sink separately.

    I think the costs of not having a budget at this time are too great to postpone. I understand the Governor’s frustration with this budget but I agree with Lois Wolk’s assessment. We need to move forward and use the existing situation to energize an immediate push to make structural changes.

    Reduce the percentage required to pass a budget.
    Reexamine redistricting.
    Push for greater accountability in all areas, including education.
    Our social use of prisons as a “solution” is way too costly – we need a long term plan to reduce crime and recidivism.
    Work for a single payer health care plan.
    Increase personal responsibility to participate in our democratic institutions – including unions.
    Make sure large corporations, who profit from education and infrastructure, are paying their real costs.
    Encourage innovation and small business, which contributes most to employment growth.
    Promote values and participation beyond consumerism. Reduce the growth in the federal military industrial complex (a tall order).

    I realize that the society I live in is a major determinant of my quality of life. To me, having a better educated, healthier, productive population participating in our country is more important than the car I drive (I may opt for a bike!), or the square footage of my house.

    And if anyone reads to the bottom of this – thanks.

  81. Anonymous

    anon 12:56 —

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor.

    It’s hard to see how illegal immigrants are the magnitude of economic drain that you like to portray. I would argue that it’s a wash. Benefits = economic “drain”.

    You suggest that we cut off our nose to spite our face. Let’s make everyone suffer (legal residents/citizens students) to avoid having to spend on educational services to illegal immigrant children. It’s hard to see how anything good comes out of that.

    We are a country that is influenced by Christian morality. Morally, we are judged by how we treat “the least among us” — poor, disabled, the marginalized. Spending adequately on education is the least we could do. An adequate education means that future adults become more effective contributors to society who are less likely to rely on the welfare system. That means future savings.

    I, too, am in the front line of education (by profession). California already spends a lower than average percent on education administration. Teachers don’t get paid very much compared to other professions.

    Cutting back funding to a critical component that is already underfunded is irresponsible.

  82. Anonymous

    anon 12:56 —

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor.

    It’s hard to see how illegal immigrants are the magnitude of economic drain that you like to portray. I would argue that it’s a wash. Benefits = economic “drain”.

    You suggest that we cut off our nose to spite our face. Let’s make everyone suffer (legal residents/citizens students) to avoid having to spend on educational services to illegal immigrant children. It’s hard to see how anything good comes out of that.

    We are a country that is influenced by Christian morality. Morally, we are judged by how we treat “the least among us” — poor, disabled, the marginalized. Spending adequately on education is the least we could do. An adequate education means that future adults become more effective contributors to society who are less likely to rely on the welfare system. That means future savings.

    I, too, am in the front line of education (by profession). California already spends a lower than average percent on education administration. Teachers don’t get paid very much compared to other professions.

    Cutting back funding to a critical component that is already underfunded is irresponsible.

  83. Anonymous

    anon 12:56 —

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor.

    It’s hard to see how illegal immigrants are the magnitude of economic drain that you like to portray. I would argue that it’s a wash. Benefits = economic “drain”.

    You suggest that we cut off our nose to spite our face. Let’s make everyone suffer (legal residents/citizens students) to avoid having to spend on educational services to illegal immigrant children. It’s hard to see how anything good comes out of that.

    We are a country that is influenced by Christian morality. Morally, we are judged by how we treat “the least among us” — poor, disabled, the marginalized. Spending adequately on education is the least we could do. An adequate education means that future adults become more effective contributors to society who are less likely to rely on the welfare system. That means future savings.

    I, too, am in the front line of education (by profession). California already spends a lower than average percent on education administration. Teachers don’t get paid very much compared to other professions.

    Cutting back funding to a critical component that is already underfunded is irresponsible.

  84. Anonymous

    anon 12:56 —

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor.

    It’s hard to see how illegal immigrants are the magnitude of economic drain that you like to portray. I would argue that it’s a wash. Benefits = economic “drain”.

    You suggest that we cut off our nose to spite our face. Let’s make everyone suffer (legal residents/citizens students) to avoid having to spend on educational services to illegal immigrant children. It’s hard to see how anything good comes out of that.

    We are a country that is influenced by Christian morality. Morally, we are judged by how we treat “the least among us” — poor, disabled, the marginalized. Spending adequately on education is the least we could do. An adequate education means that future adults become more effective contributors to society who are less likely to rely on the welfare system. That means future savings.

    I, too, am in the front line of education (by profession). California already spends a lower than average percent on education administration. Teachers don’t get paid very much compared to other professions.

    Cutting back funding to a critical component that is already underfunded is irresponsible.

  85. Anonymous

    “It’s hard to see how illegal immigrants are the magnitude of economic drain that you like to portray. I would argue that it’s a wash. Benefits = economic “drain”.”

    Umm, if hundreds come across the border everyday and have kids, you have to educate them, you have to tax your resources to build additional facilities ie schools.

  86. Anonymous

    “It’s hard to see how illegal immigrants are the magnitude of economic drain that you like to portray. I would argue that it’s a wash. Benefits = economic “drain”.”

    Umm, if hundreds come across the border everyday and have kids, you have to educate them, you have to tax your resources to build additional facilities ie schools.

  87. Anonymous

    “It’s hard to see how illegal immigrants are the magnitude of economic drain that you like to portray. I would argue that it’s a wash. Benefits = economic “drain”.”

    Umm, if hundreds come across the border everyday and have kids, you have to educate them, you have to tax your resources to build additional facilities ie schools.

  88. Anonymous

    “It’s hard to see how illegal immigrants are the magnitude of economic drain that you like to portray. I would argue that it’s a wash. Benefits = economic “drain”.”

    Umm, if hundreds come across the border everyday and have kids, you have to educate them, you have to tax your resources to build additional facilities ie schools.

  89. Anonymous

    “Umm, if hundreds come across the border everyday and have kids, you have to educate them, you have to tax your resources to build additional facilities ie schools.”

    You don’t read carefully:

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor. Because we don’t have to pay higher prices on certain goods and services because of immigrant labor, it allows a supply side effect allowing those consumers to consume other things and pay the taxes on those things.

  90. Anonymous

    “Umm, if hundreds come across the border everyday and have kids, you have to educate them, you have to tax your resources to build additional facilities ie schools.”

    You don’t read carefully:

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor. Because we don’t have to pay higher prices on certain goods and services because of immigrant labor, it allows a supply side effect allowing those consumers to consume other things and pay the taxes on those things.

  91. Anonymous

    “Umm, if hundreds come across the border everyday and have kids, you have to educate them, you have to tax your resources to build additional facilities ie schools.”

    You don’t read carefully:

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor. Because we don’t have to pay higher prices on certain goods and services because of immigrant labor, it allows a supply side effect allowing those consumers to consume other things and pay the taxes on those things.

  92. Anonymous

    “Umm, if hundreds come across the border everyday and have kids, you have to educate them, you have to tax your resources to build additional facilities ie schools.”

    You don’t read carefully:

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor. Because we don’t have to pay higher prices on certain goods and services because of immigrant labor, it allows a supply side effect allowing those consumers to consume other things and pay the taxes on those things.

  93. Anonymous 3:05

    You don’t read carefully:

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    To a certain extent I agree with you. I buy the sales tax argument. I buy the property tax, although if they are undocumented.. Federal Income Taxes and Payroll Taxes is debateable. I doubt people who can’t speak or read/write english fill out 1040’s.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor. Because we don’t have to pay higher prices on certain goods and services because of immigrant labor, it allows a supply side effect allowing those consumers to consume other things and pay the taxes on those things.

    Good point. Too true. But there is a darkside. A lot of them are in our prisons. Much of the drug trade comes over the border. That causes more crime and more poverty. One of the most Notorious ciminal gangs in CA comes from south of the border.

    There is good and bad.

  94. Anonymous 3:05

    You don’t read carefully:

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    To a certain extent I agree with you. I buy the sales tax argument. I buy the property tax, although if they are undocumented.. Federal Income Taxes and Payroll Taxes is debateable. I doubt people who can’t speak or read/write english fill out 1040’s.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor. Because we don’t have to pay higher prices on certain goods and services because of immigrant labor, it allows a supply side effect allowing those consumers to consume other things and pay the taxes on those things.

    Good point. Too true. But there is a darkside. A lot of them are in our prisons. Much of the drug trade comes over the border. That causes more crime and more poverty. One of the most Notorious ciminal gangs in CA comes from south of the border.

    There is good and bad.

  95. Anonymous 3:05

    You don’t read carefully:

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    To a certain extent I agree with you. I buy the sales tax argument. I buy the property tax, although if they are undocumented.. Federal Income Taxes and Payroll Taxes is debateable. I doubt people who can’t speak or read/write english fill out 1040’s.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor. Because we don’t have to pay higher prices on certain goods and services because of immigrant labor, it allows a supply side effect allowing those consumers to consume other things and pay the taxes on those things.

    Good point. Too true. But there is a darkside. A lot of them are in our prisons. Much of the drug trade comes over the border. That causes more crime and more poverty. One of the most Notorious ciminal gangs in CA comes from south of the border.

    There is good and bad.

  96. Anonymous 3:05

    You don’t read carefully:

    Illegal immigrants pay taxes: sales taxes, whenever they purchase something that is applicable, property taxes — directly or indirectly — when they pay rent or mortgage, and other taxes to one degree or another.

    To a certain extent I agree with you. I buy the sales tax argument. I buy the property tax, although if they are undocumented.. Federal Income Taxes and Payroll Taxes is debateable. I doubt people who can’t speak or read/write english fill out 1040’s.

    We get an economic subsidy (lower consumer prices) because of their cheap labor. Because we don’t have to pay higher prices on certain goods and services because of immigrant labor, it allows a supply side effect allowing those consumers to consume other things and pay the taxes on those things.

    Good point. Too true. But there is a darkside. A lot of them are in our prisons. Much of the drug trade comes over the border. That causes more crime and more poverty. One of the most Notorious ciminal gangs in CA comes from south of the border.

    There is good and bad.

  97. Anonymous

    To Anon,(3:05),

    Please add in one of the most crucial factors here. OVERPOPULATION. I look down the road and see this unlawful influx as mostly, and ultimately, a doom for portions of the U.S. They need to stay home and get their government working for them, not come here and have us support them and their children.

  98. Anonymous

    To Anon,(3:05),

    Please add in one of the most crucial factors here. OVERPOPULATION. I look down the road and see this unlawful influx as mostly, and ultimately, a doom for portions of the U.S. They need to stay home and get their government working for them, not come here and have us support them and their children.

  99. Anonymous

    To Anon,(3:05),

    Please add in one of the most crucial factors here. OVERPOPULATION. I look down the road and see this unlawful influx as mostly, and ultimately, a doom for portions of the U.S. They need to stay home and get their government working for them, not come here and have us support them and their children.

  100. Anonymous

    To Anon,(3:05),

    Please add in one of the most crucial factors here. OVERPOPULATION. I look down the road and see this unlawful influx as mostly, and ultimately, a doom for portions of the U.S. They need to stay home and get their government working for them, not come here and have us support them and their children.

  101. Anonymous

    I just multiplied 360,000 x $8600.00 per child of illegal immigrant. That is $30.96 billion per year paid to educate children of persons who entered this contry illegally. I wonder how much real tax is paid by those parents. They do send billions home annually and the mexican government counts on it.
    $30,960,000.00 would solve the budget crisis of California and provide billions more for a better educational system for the legal citizens of California. For those of you about to jump on your bleeding heart liberal soapbox, I know they are already here.
    By the way that does not include the criminal justice system costs for the same group, of which they are a LARGE part. What is your opinion Mr. Greenwald?

  102. Anonymous

    I just multiplied 360,000 x $8600.00 per child of illegal immigrant. That is $30.96 billion per year paid to educate children of persons who entered this contry illegally. I wonder how much real tax is paid by those parents. They do send billions home annually and the mexican government counts on it.
    $30,960,000.00 would solve the budget crisis of California and provide billions more for a better educational system for the legal citizens of California. For those of you about to jump on your bleeding heart liberal soapbox, I know they are already here.
    By the way that does not include the criminal justice system costs for the same group, of which they are a LARGE part. What is your opinion Mr. Greenwald?

  103. Anonymous

    I just multiplied 360,000 x $8600.00 per child of illegal immigrant. That is $30.96 billion per year paid to educate children of persons who entered this contry illegally. I wonder how much real tax is paid by those parents. They do send billions home annually and the mexican government counts on it.
    $30,960,000.00 would solve the budget crisis of California and provide billions more for a better educational system for the legal citizens of California. For those of you about to jump on your bleeding heart liberal soapbox, I know they are already here.
    By the way that does not include the criminal justice system costs for the same group, of which they are a LARGE part. What is your opinion Mr. Greenwald?

  104. Anonymous

    I just multiplied 360,000 x $8600.00 per child of illegal immigrant. That is $30.96 billion per year paid to educate children of persons who entered this contry illegally. I wonder how much real tax is paid by those parents. They do send billions home annually and the mexican government counts on it.
    $30,960,000.00 would solve the budget crisis of California and provide billions more for a better educational system for the legal citizens of California. For those of you about to jump on your bleeding heart liberal soapbox, I know they are already here.
    By the way that does not include the criminal justice system costs for the same group, of which they are a LARGE part. What is your opinion Mr. Greenwald?

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