Justice Watch: A Lot of Finger Pointing out of Chicago

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Office Van Dyke Arrested
Chicago police Officer Jason Van Dyke arrives at the Leighton Criminal Courthouse in Chicago on Nov. 24, 2015. Antonio Perez/Chicago Tribune via Getty Images

Last night, 60 Minutes had a segment called “Crisis in Chicago.”  The crisis is real – in the last year, more than 700 people murdered, 4000 shot.  As 60 Minutes correspondent Bill Whitaker pointed out, “That’s more than Los Angeles and New York combined.”

What has happened is also clear: “There’s been a drop in the kind of police work that law enforcement says is critical to preventing crime. Usually stops and arrests go up when violence is rising. So we went to Chicago to look for an explanation. What we found was a police department on its heels as the city suffered its worst bloodshed in 18 years.”

Here is the problem: “In August of 2015, cops stopped and questioned 49,257 people. A year later those stops dropped to 8,859, down 80 percent. At the same time arrests were off by a third, from just over 10,000 to 6,900.”

What comes next is excuses for police not doing their jobs.  And apparently neither the political establishment or the police leadership can make them do so.

60 Minutes interviewed Brian Warner, a former Chicago cop who was shot in 2011.  According to Bill Whitaker, “Now Warner counsels officers suffering from extreme stress. He explained what a dozen beat cops told us off-camera: they had stepped back.”

Mr. Warner explained, “You have a 911 call, you go to your 911 call. But if you’re one– aggressive patrol when you’re out looking for people breaking the law. That’s not happening as much as it was.”

Garry McCarthy, Chicago’s former police superintendent explained, “The police activity is horrific. Honestly. And there, and there’s not an excuse that could be made in my book.”  He added, “When you have activity falling off the way it is and crime skyrocketing, that’s a huge problem.”

Mr. Whitaker explains, “This crisis inside the police department began in 2014 with the shooting of Laquan McDonald. He was 17 years old. Police reported McDonald was breaking into vehicles and ignored their commands when they said he lunged at one of them with a knife. But dashboard video appears to show McDonald was moving away when he was shot 16 times by a white officer.”

As we have reported, when Garry McCarthy saw the video, he turned it over to the independent city agency that reviews shootings.  But City Hall refused to make the video public, even after it paid McDonald’s family a $5 million settlement.

“When a judge finally ordered the video released a year later, it sparked outrage. Protesters accused the city of a cover-up to protect Mayor Rahm Emanuel’s reelection. The mayor denied it, but promised sweeping changes. His first move was to fire Garry McCarthy,” Mr. Whitaker reported.

Mr. McCarthy explained, “Officers are under attack. That’s how they feel, right. That’s how they feel in this environment, and they’re not going to put themselves and their families in jeopardy.”

Mr. Whitaker reported, “Frustration among cops deepened with a new order to be more selective about who they stopped, and write a two-page detailed report for every one. It was the result of a threat by the American Civil Liberties Union to sue the department for racial profiling.”

A task force added to the “problem” with a searing report that found evidence of racial bias, chronicling that nearly 90 percent of police shootings involved minorities and of course the report concludes, “CPD’s own data gives validity to the widely held belief the police have no regard for the sanctity of life when it comes to people of color.”

They add, “Stopped without justification, verbally and physically abused, and in some instances arrested, and then detained without counsel—that is what we heard about over and over again.”

As Garry McCarthy put it, “The noncompliance of the law is becoming legitimized. And the police are on their heels. They’re on their heels for a number of reasons.”  He would add, “We’re reaching a state of lawlessness.”

But at the same time, “stops by police in the neighborhood have dropped by almost 80 percent.”

So the police are basically arguing through their actions that the only way they can do their job is business as usual.  And if they can’t continue the policies that were detailed in the task force report, they will do what appears to be a minimal amount of effort – they will respond to a 911 call, but they won’t, as Brian Warner explained, be proactive.

“It’s my job to go to work and listen to your 911 calls and respond. That’s the basic ability of my job. So if you want me to do the basics that’s what I am doing now,” he explained.

But they won’t go further.  As Eddie Johnson, the new police superintendent explains, “the main reasons for the drop in police activity were stricter standards for stops and the forms triggered by the ACLU.”

He also said they are becoming more careful: “They are cautious about doing their jobs.”

But Bill Whitaker pressed his question, “You are calling it caution. They’re telling us it’s backing down.”

Eddie Johnson responded, “You know I still go out in the field and I talk to officers too. And they take offense to people referring to them as backing down or not doing their job.”

But Bill Whitaker pointed out, “So the number of stops and arrests are going down dramatically. And the number of people being shot and killed are going up dramatically. There’s got to be a correlation.”

All I see here are excuses from the leadership for the lack of action by the police.  They are not doing their job, the murder rates are skyrocketing because of it, but the fault lies with the ACLU and the people complaining about racial profiling and police brutality – or so the excuses game goes.

—David M. Greenwald reporting

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About The Author

David Greenwald is the founder, editor, and executive director of the Davis Vanguard. He founded the Vanguard in 2006. David Greenwald moved to Davis in 1996 to attend Graduate School at UC Davis in Political Science. He lives in South Davis with his wife Cecilia Escamilla Greenwald and three children.

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34 thoughts on “Justice Watch: A Lot of Finger Pointing out of Chicago”

  1. Tia Will

    I wonder if we would accept analogous excuse making from other professions.  I will, of course, use medicine as my example. Let’s suppose that a colleague of mine has a bad outcome ( maybe because of a mistake, or maybe because it is possible to do everything right and still have a bad outcome) let’s say a baby born with cerebral palsy. My colleague loses the ensuing lawsuit and the award ends up being in the millions. Does anyone believe that there will be better outcomes if doctors start refusing to take care of high risk patients or worse yet stop seeing any pregnant patients at all unless they are on call and called in when the patient is already in crisis ? Do we not have an obligation as doctors to take care of those in need regardless of the risk of a law suit, or even review of our license ?  The decision to be a doctor entails accepting all of the possible outcomes of that decision including the possible loss of lawsuits and/or one’s license. In the case of some doctors performing legal procedures of which others do not approve, their dedication has cost them their lives. Likewise doctors choose to operate in emergency before knowing the HIV or Hep C status of the patient putting their own lives at risk. Would we support them allowing a patient to die while awaiting the blood test proving the procedure was safe…..for the doctor ?

    Police knowingly take on a job that entails risk to themselves. If they do not want to do that job, they should resign and let others who are dedicated to the profession do the job.

  2. Marina Kalugin

    and why not..   I mean that is where the BO was born and raised or something.  Yeah I know that is not one of the places on a birth cert.. .but I mean figuratively not literally.

    where crime runs rampant and those in the gov get more and more  money for looking the other way…

    then the same folks moved to Washington DC, to work not to live, and started working on their net worth even more..  …

    I could say a ton of things to the medical professionals on this list about how many boys and girls were maimed by the unneeded new vaccines for children … especially the ones in the gynecological field..  but I will refrain..

    And I don’t know if you, Dr. Will also got your $40K for having ALL your patients up on their vaccines..  tsk tsk..   or did you give up the bonus for the sake of letting parents decide if those latest vaccines were worth the scientifically proven and documented risks or not?

    And if anyone thinks this is off topic ya can get your head out of the toilet.. it is easy to say. .. “police should know better” just as it is easy for a non-MD to say..

    jeez. . why are not more docs getting the connections between the huge increases in vaccines and children in the USA getting sicker and sicker and so on. . of course they are being trained and paid by big pharma jeez

  3. Tia Will

    Marina

    I am not sure how you got from police or doctors, or any other profession doing their jobs, to Barack Obama. I am sure you are aware that maintaining safely on the streets of a city, regardless of his previous place of residence is not in the job description of President of the United States.

    unneeded new vaccines for children … especially the ones in the gynecological field..  but I will refrain..”

    Well it is a good thing that you are refraining since ob/gyn’s do not prescribe for children at all.

    Dr. Will also got your $40K for having ALL your patients up on their vaccines..  tsk tsk..   or did you give up the bonus for the sake of letting parents decide if those latest vaccines were worth the scientifically proven and documented risks or not?”

    I do not know where you ever got this idea that any Kaiser doctor gets a $40K bonus for having a given number of patient’s up to date on vaccines. As a former member of our administration team, I am well aware that no frontline doctor in Kaiser gets a $ 40,000 / yr bonus. This is either a myth, or I have passed up 1.2 million dollars over the years. Also, I have never coerced any patient into any intervention. Unlike you who have the luxury of choosing to believe and promulgate only one side of the story, I present every patient with the risks and benefits of any medical intervention and they then choose for themselves.

    I cannot help but wonder where you get your information about the details of medical training ? Would you care to cite your references, or is this one of those cases where you will merely tell me to do “my own research” completely oblivious to the fact that I have likely read much, much more than you have on the subject over the years. So easy to just through around the word “jeez” as though it had some content. How about actually discussing the issue which would mean citing some articles or evidence ?

     

    1. Jaroslaw Waszczuk

      I am not sure how you got from police or doctors, or any other profession doing their jobs, to Barack Obama. I am sure you are aware that maintaining safely on the streets of a city, regardless of his previous place of residence is not in the job description of President of the United States.

      Tia

      Regardless of the reason Marina included President Barak Obama was included into discussion , the Mayor of Chicago Rahm Emanuel should ask  the Federal Authorities for help to get grim situation in Chicago under control . Barak Obama was a community organizer in Chicago and Rahm Emanuel was the President Obama’s Chief of Stuff. Rahm Emanuel’s best buddy Axel Axelrod was the chief strategist for the Barak Obama’s presidential campaigns in 2008 and 2012.

       700 people murdered, 4000 shot in one year and most likely majority of them were black people and President Obama is silent about t such slaughter and about his buddy Rahm job  performance who is  Mayor of the City of Chicago. Don’t you think that President Obama should give an order to the  US Attorney General to  investigate and find out what is going  in Chicago’s  City Hall ?  This is the  worse situation than war in Afghanistan and looks life in Chicago is very cheap.

  4. Marina Kalugin

    BO got his start in Chicago, and it is still one of the crookedest cities around…  it is not a huge leap to bring that up in the context of what you were sharing….

    Also I doubt that Kaiser doctors were getting the bonuses ..it is after all Kaiser.

    But the reason I brought up that particular unneeded vaccine is because it is the one which is supposed to stop the HPPV virus which now even young girls and young boys prior to the age of puberty are “encouraged” to receive.. of course puberty is now hitting girls as young as 8-9. and according to may studies in pubmed..  toxins like BPA or it many cousins are to blame…

    I thought that perhaps you are in that general area of medicine it may make more sense….and you may know about some of those things..

    Because of my departments very close relationship with the UC Davis cancer center, our Chair was/is co/acting/asst director of the center, many of our faculty are on the Center board, and the T32 cancer center was/is run by and was/is still administered by “my” department for many a year, one learns things..   at least I do…

    PS. though I had dropped the premed curriculum at UC Davis back in 72..  I never lost my interest in certain health topics..  and still do research on pub med.. as things present themselves…. like when family and friends get cancer..    and so on. .   and that is how I chanced about Guardasil a few years back…

    PS>   All ya gotta do is walk around any cliinic or hospital and see who is paying the bills.. .. all ya got to do is look at the documents that are posted everywhere about ask your doctor.  all ya got to do is read in the papers about how the UC doctors are no longer allowed to get gifts or trips from their big pharma reps.

    All one has to do is know a few younger doctors very well.. including some who were in Gate in Davis with my sons.. .. and all one has to do is stop being an ostrich person and follow the money and learn the truth..

    And if ya want links, ya can help to my FB wall and scroll back til ya find it.. recently I haven’t been posting about that as much as heck, I have some real life/death matters to attend to today..

    cya..

    PS>  If you want to watch a few documentaries full of scientific references and real studies.. I can share some links,    as well as many functional med MDs/ODs sites from this US of A and any other country of which you may know the language. and some real books to read full of references in proper pub med format..  like the NIH fomat…. some you may even find in the Health Sciences Library at UCD>>>.

    sorry..  I doubt this will be up much longer but really folks follow the money and learn the truth..

    [moderator] I’m going to leave this, but please understand that most of it is really way off topic. I’d like to request that all of these quasi-medical discussions — whether it be vaccinations, cancer rates, etc. — be considered off topic unless that is the specific topic of the thread. Thanks.

    1. Howard P

       request that all of these quasi-medical discussions

      Just on this thread, Don, or in general as to “analogies”?  I take your comment as a ‘request’… the very way you worded it… I can easily live with that… will help keep me out of trouble… false analogies trouble me, and get my dander up (inappropriately acted on by me)… David/Board… please consider Don’s request… on this thread, or more generally…

  5. Jaroslaw Waszczuk

    Chicago’s racial employment gaps among worst in nation

    A report by the Brookings Institution shows that of the nation’s largest metro areas, Chicago has the greatest racial disparity in young adult employment rates
     
    Nearly a quarter of black 20- to 24-year-olds in the Chicago area are disconnected from work and school, compared with 3.3 percent of whites, the widest gap among the large metro areas, according to the report. The rate is 6.6 percent among Latinos and 2.2 percent among Asians in Chicago in that age group.
    http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-brookings-disconnected-youth-report-0525-biz-20160524-story.html

  6. Marina Kalugin

    Chicago and its crime rate, from what I have observed over the decades, has held somewhat steady..  though they had a Black Mayer who later went off to WDC  and so on.

    Some of the many reasons I voted for him included his promises to label GMOs  ( he had a chance to veto the Dark Act and chose not to)..  to instill a national health program  ( Obamacare only helped a few million of folks and for many reasons those who were underemployed in states where there was no Medi-Cal or equivalent still had no insurance and now were required to pay for the overpriced BO garbage..  of course BO and family still got the best…in the meantime many many of my elder colleagues, especially the ones who were self employed lost good coverage and were paying through the nose for way worse coverage..  Bernie rolled out a plan which I was advocating to anyone who would listen when this all started.. only big pharma, big chemical companies and insurance companies made money on the deal). . and also he promised to ensure that the most disadvantaged would have jobs and to minimize the various gaps…  Very quickly I was finding his policies were doing nada for those families in the deep south and elsewhere where many generations of black men have not had a job in generations and the women had lots of children and lived on the dole…

    And the crime rates throughout the USA are higher and higher and corruption is only worse and worse..

    I am in a “better” place trying to heal..  Many currently on the DV do not know what “projects” I have been involved in … throughout this town since 1970..  and elsewhere..  those that do or have known me on campaigns and such will understand me better..  I am often on the forefront of cutting edge whatever.. . whether it is black rights in the SF Bay area in the 60s to against the Vietnam war in the 60s in SF/Berkeley and surroundings  and in Davis in the 70s..

    In the last two decades I have learned that if one follows AMA guidelines they are sure to get sick.. and if one compares the “recommendations” of the USA to other much more civilized countries you may understand why.

    BO policies filled the schools and the preschools and the likes of First Five with garbage unfit for human consumption…..

    If one heads to places like Chicago, where I went to see one of my favorite doctors on this planet now nearly 16 years ago, because I couldn’t find a single functional medicine MD throughout the region, and found it an amazing city but noticed the great divide worse than anywhere I had been before… and TODAY…… the great divide is even greater..   Oprah was pushing Mr BOs career, while many areas of Chicago never got any better..

    The land of Chicago was the land of the great divide..   .just like now in Oakland CA< and South Sac and even Stockton..

    And it only got worse and the crime rates got worse and the corruption is no better than when the Mafia was in charge how many decades ago..  but now it is even more corrupt cops and policies where children of the poor get nada but left over trash.. while the wealthy are living it up with newer and fancier restaurants..  ala many of the latest and greatest food network shows..

    I is ALWAYS   follow the money and learn the truth..

    First Five pushes the agendas of Bayer/Monsanto …. .and the children are much more ill due to that…

    Matt Williams Jr… .actually listened, researched and found out that heck, those of us on the anti-flouride side were not as nutty as Former Council Member Dan Wolk made us out to be..

    It is ALWAYS follow the money and learn the truth….

    I started learning that in the late 50s as an immigrant to SF..   the third  country my family had to flee in my lifetime..alone… and heck there was a freudian slip in there .which I caught before hitting send. …I inadvertently added “communist” in front of country..  my family fled several communist countries… .because where I was born, that country no longer exists..    English is my third Fluent language…  and now I am learning my fourth and never even touched Mandarin…the main language of the asian country where I was born.. . though it wasn’t named China during the years my family settled there….

    In the USA many children do not learn another language… even my sons who were born here were not native English speakers.. their dad and I tried to teach them Russian first…   once you are older, and many studies show anywhere from 6-9  is the latest one can learn a new language without having a permanent accent… though in the countries where a lot of languages are spoken everywhere and the latin roots are the same.. it may be later…

    WTF does this have anything to do with anything?   It is one of the main reasons why children in the USA lag.. while the likes of Bayer/Monsanto have such a hold in this country and not elsewhere… why the gap only widens and why those who are educated here are not the ones who are actually creating the breakthroughs in STEM and elsewhere..

    Why the divide between black and white and other minorities only widens.. and why the Asian and Indian/Pakistani children are not considered minorities in CA and why blacks and latinos are..

    It is ALWAYS follow the money and learn the truth…

    And those on here who continue to spout whatever when they really have no clue… well.   sorry for you and your families and children..

    It is only worse now to be a child in CA.   follow the money and LEARN the f truth….

     

    1. Jaroslaw Waszczuk

      Why the divide between black and white and other minorities only widens.. and why the Asian and Indian/Pakistani children are not considered minorities in CA and why blacks and latinos are..

      Marina

      Are you sure ?

       

      1. Marina Kalugin

        sure about which part, Jerry?   that the asians and Indian/Pakistanis are not considered minorities for affirmative action purposes in CA?  or that the divide is widening between the poorer minorities and those categories which are not considered minorities. .or that education is a huge issue that affects who is more likely to commit a crime and that poorer families are often not as well educated and also more likely to commit crimes?   or that the family culture is not as important? or that clean water, food and so on doesn’t matter in the child to education to work or crime path?   now ya got me confused.. what are ya questioning?   back to bed.. it may be clearer tomorrow.. or maybe not.

        1. Jaroslaw Waszczuk

           

          Asian and Indian/Pakistani children are not considered minorities?

          Marina .

          I think you are right . They are “Caucasians”  .  Now I understand how the  corporal  Adolf Hitler got his ideas about the  superior race . Still going

          . The Supreme Court in United States v. Bhagat Singh Thind (1923) decided that Asian Indians were ineligible for citizenship because, though deemed “Caucasian” anthropologically, they were not white like European descendants since most laypeople did not consider them to be “white” people. This represented a change from the Supreme Court’s earlier opinion in Ozawa v. United States, in which it had expressly approved of two lower court cases holding “high caste Hindus” to be “free white persons” within the meaning of the naturalization act. Government lawyers later recognized that the Supreme Court had “withdrawn” this approval in Thind.[50] In 1946, the U.S. Congress passed a new law establishing a small immigration quota for Indians, which also permitted them to become citizens

  7. Marina Kalugin

    oh..   thank you for the doc, Jerry.. and yes, I have actually seen that some many decades ago..

    however I meant more that in CA ..  asian and Indian/Pakistanis , because they are raised differently, are fed differently and are not so culpable to believing the lies of the AMA/ADA  Bayer/Monsanto.. etc.

    because they are more down to the earth.. and more understanding of the values in chinese medicine and other ancient therapies, and which work better and are kinder on the body, while the many many extended family who are around 24/7. .remember the REAL village concept.  to ensuer children are cared for, eat well, do their schoolwork, and have time to play and learn also..

    Regardless of the Indian or Pakistani sects, their understanding of spiritual life  and anciet wisdoms also supercede the AMA/ADA.. and also all of the same applies to their families as well….

    than those who  came to the USA some generations ago, and are much more high achieving .. that most of the affirmative action policies do not apply to those categories.

    Perhaps, Jerry.. you may find that more recent immigrants. Russians and other Slavs, EU and Scandinavians..  also have a heads up..  in just about any classroom in the USA..

    Children who are raised elsewhere and are not so poisoned or live with their extended families and get the village in reality.    ..   unlike what HRC was claiming….

    PS>  The latest international genome project spearheaded by the only HHMI investigator at UCSC is bringing in more proof and evidence that out of the many thousands of new complete genomes finished, there is not a single folks yet without some african blood.

    When one of my sons had a  (brief) temp job at the UCD Law School he, like me, was asking questions..  .like why is it if some applicant’s great great grandma was black.. and everyone else is white, why was he instructed to code the applicant as Black..?
    He finally went to ask for a different assignment as the responses were only more and more crazy..

     

     

     

    1. Jaroslaw Waszczuk

      Marina

      The United States of America is the country where you are considered as  “Caucasian” if if you are not deplorable . Color of the skin is not the factor if you live in Beverly Hill .

      Follow the money and learn the true.

      1. Jaroslaw Waszczuk

        Howard’

        People in the United States do not profile themselves so much as American government does by classifying and segregating people  by color, race and ethnicity. In the last 8 years the country became more segregated and divided more than before Obama’s presidency and after 1964.

        1. Howard P

          You do realize of course, that the government does so in the wake of  “minorities” pushing for the classifications for affirmative action and other purposes, right?

          ‘Classification’ is one thing… ‘segregation’ is another… I dispute your concept that segregation has increased… will ask you to document that assertion… if you were here before 1964, you’d know we are a lot less segregated than we were in the 40’s, 50’s, or 60’s… except for the ‘self-segregation’ that has occurred in some Russian/Laotian/Vietnamese/Sihk and other communities… same occurred for the Irish/Puerto Rican/German/Polish/Italian/Chinese/Japanese etc. communities in the last 150 years or so.  That ‘segregation’ was not dictated by the government over most of that time.

        2. Jaroslaw Waszczuk

          Howard

          I no need  to show you any documents  . DV is crying about discrimination and injustice almost every day . Your response did not change fact that the United States for 188 years was officially  racially segregated country since the  Declaration of Independence  and  was segregated  for  almost 25 years  after Nazi Germany were defeated. The “minorities”  name  is  good term for politicians. We are not going to change anything by arguing about . This what it is . What I see myself is that  the newcomers from Asia or Europe doing a lot better in United States than millions of Americans who born here and have roots  10 or more generations back .  Not to pointing at the color Chicago is  the one of the example . I hoping that Sacramento with new Mayor in charge would not follow  City of Chicago.

        3. Howard P

          Your numbers are wrong, particularly for the country in the main… I accept that America is a second history for you… follow the history…

          Most Americans have direct ancestors who have been here less than 150 years (in many cases, much less)… 3/4 of mine were… none of my direct ancestors have been here less than 135 years… the other 1/4 have been here since America was a colony of GB…

          I recognize one race… the human race.  Welcome to America [belatedly], and the human race.

          [oh, and yes, was subject to ‘reverse discrimination’ several times, but succeeded anyhow…]

           

        4. Jaroslaw Waszczuk

          Howard

          Yours response is trivial. Apartheid  is apartheid and it does not matter how you wrapped it. Would  it matter for you if Hitler would killed  five million Jews instead of six million . The Holocaust is  the Holocaust.

        5. Howard P

          Jerry… ok, whatever… appears your ears are closed, and/or you have an agenda/world view I don’t want to deal with…

          I do know that going back to my GGGranfather and his brother who ran a stop on the UG Railroad, there is no racism in this family… can you say the same?

          [moderator] off topic

        6. Howard P

          The Holocaust is  the Holocaust.

          Yes.  True story… my ancestors had nothing to do with that… did yours?

          Kinda’ recall that the Poles did little/nothing to stop it… except the one “uprising”… pretty much all of those left no descendants…

          My ancestors acted. As to slavery…

        7. Jaroslaw Waszczuk

          Howard

          Didn’t you read about MS.St. Louis which was sailing  so close to Florida that Jews  could see the lights of Miami.  

          How the Poland should stop Holocaust. …
          [moderator] Edited, way, way off topic. Come on, folks.

  8. Marina Kalugin

    huh?  sharing some truth stories to show just how bad it has gotten in the US of A….

    what happened to the melting pot?  if ya are a 16th Native American ya qualify for the STEM Womens handup at UCD. .

    if you are the other kind of Indian.  you are part of the quota to keep out… think I am kidding?

    Look at the HIB documents..and the Fed quota systems for those who made it here despite their ethnicity.

    If you are from Japan, you can more easily get your perm res.. if ya are from the other Asian country, China, you better have been an invited speaker at one of the most prestigious NIH conferences..

    And yet, if ya are a Pacific Islander, you are welcome with lower statistics to UCD that is..

     

    And anyone who doesn’t think that racial profiling goes on.. even in Davis. have you ever looked up DWB and gotten the statistics of how many stops of Blacks occur in Davis. compared to how many blacks live here?

    it is even way worse in the poorer areas of Chicago. even by black cops.. nothing like those who got out to punish those who didn’t yet….

  9. Howard P

    Maybe off topic… what is “justice”?

    Is a cop accused of ‘wrongful death’, more culpable than a “gang-banger” who kills another?  If so, please explain why.

    Should “justice” be meted out according to whether someone has ‘privilege’, or ‘oppressed?  And, if so, why?

    Back to the question… what is “justice” in your view, David?  I perceive that the baby Justice was not treated justly by his family.

    Perhaps it would have been more “just” if baby Justice had been aborted, even by ‘partial birth’ measures?

    Just looking for clarification on what you, David, define “justice” as…

  10. Jaroslaw Waszczuk

    Moderator Mr. Don Shor

    I don’t understand why did you cut the discussion between me and  Howard .  We got a little  of topic in discussion but if Howard made accusations that Poland made nothing to stop Holocaust (and his accusations are still there ) than automatically you cut my proper rebuttal to his accusations . I noticed that if I mention Stalin and Soviet Union in the discussion than you freaking out and you cutting me off. I am from Poland and somebody is making unfounded accusations against my country than I have the right to respond.

    Beside the above I found interesting that the President- Elect Donald Trump in December 2016 met the Chicago Mayor Rahm Emanuel and they discussed “the killing field ” situation in City of Chicago. Also President Elect Donald Trump met in December 2016 Rahm Emanuel’s brother Ezekiel Emanuael  who was White House adviser to President Barack Obama on healthcare and a key architect of the Affordable Care Act,(Obama Care) .

    By reading the articles about the President Elect meetings with Emanuel’s brothers I am not quite  not sure if the meeting with Mayor of Chicago Rahm Emanuel was in fact about uncontrolled violence in Chicago or  about the Obama Care . Rahm Manuel as a President Obama Chief of Staff wanted to overhaul the Obama Care in contrary to his brother Ezekiel Emanuel .

    According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rahm_Emanuel , Rahm Emanuel  has a reputation for his no-holds-barred negotiation style that involves “his share of shouting and cursing”. At a January 2010 closed-door meeting in the White House with liberal activists, Rahm Emanuel called them fu..ing retarded” for planning to run TV ads attacking conservative Democrats who didn’t support Obama’s health-care overhaul. After the remarks were quoted in a front-page story of the Wall Street Journal and after he was criticized by Sarah Palin Emanuel apologized to organizations for the mentally handicapped for using the word “retarded. But he never apologized to liberals.

    The Rahm Emanuel’s  negotiation style with his opponents was  most likely the  important factor which  opened the door for him to the Trump Tower.

    The third Emanuel brother Ari Emanuel was the agent for the Donald Trump in the Miss  Universe show . The world is so small .

     

    [moderator] “I don’t understand why did you cut the discussion between me and Howard . ” Because the Holocaust was off topic from the crime rate in Chicago. I didn’t want it to go any further.

    1. Jaroslaw Waszczuk

      Howard

      I am not offended. However , I  felt  that I should respond in proper manner to your statement.

      The Holocaust and Poland is the broader problem in USA . I was forced to address this issue in one of my motions  in the First Amendment court case against the  University of California

      Plaintiff was trying hard not to bring racially related issues into lawsuits, but Plaintiff has been constantly provoked by Defendants since 2005. Polish jokes, as well as incorrectly calling Nazis concentration camps the Polish concentration camps or Polish death camps are falsehoods that, unfortunately, have become part of America’s heritage and are publicized everywhere by certain groups of people or organizations, as well as mainstream newspapers, and such accusations made by the Defendants, Oropeza’s, Nichols’s, and Seifert’s  are no surprise for the Plaintiff.
       
       Indeed, Poles and Polish-Americans expressed outrage in May 2012 at President Obama’s reference earlier to Auschwitz as “a Polish death camp”—as opposed to a Nazi death camp by German-occupied Poland. http://abcnews.uo.comiblogsipolitics12012/05/president-obama-causes-outrage-with-reference-to-polish-death,camps.
       If the president of the United States of America implies that Polish people ran the death camps and committed atrocities against the Jews, I am not surprised that the Defendants  Danesha Nichols, Cindy Oropeza or Brent Seifert or UCOP’s General Counsel  would make up genocide stories about Plaintiff who born six years after War War II.. On April 17, 2014, California’s Attorney General, representing the California Unemployment Insurance Appeal Board (CUTAB) in a joint effort with the University of California (Real Party in Interest) filed a frivolous Demurrer to defeat Plaintiff (petitioner); however, both parties retreated and withdrew the frivolous Demurrer on June 9, 2014.

    2. David Greenwald Post author

      One of the reasons we stop conversations at off-topic is because they distract from the purpose of the article AND they tend to start getting into personal attacks.

  11. Marina Kalugin

    if one were to be a proper moderator, one would scrub the personal attacks and not the message..

    nothing here is offtopic if one gets a clue..  to bad soo many here have not a clue

     

    what Milo has to say is likely mild compared to what those of us who escaped communism at least once in our lifetimes could share.. . and the i@@@@@@@@ who have nada clue are wasting time on that s@@@@@@@@ really?

    read about the woman who didn’t like the “attitude” of the owners of Bellisima Ballet school the other day.. and look in the mirrors and so on.. omg.. I suggested she head straight to Pamela Trokanski’s for many reasons. .

    jees…

      1. Marina Kalugin

        the DV needs more and better moderators… any volunteers?  not me..  I only hang here when everything else is done for the day… the attorneys offices are closed and so on…  and I have already shared real truth on FB… where the folks either know more than me about issues or appreciate my input… not always but more often than not..  the ostrich people disappear pretty fast..

        ya know the ones who say..

        EVERYONE knows the MMR virus is not live…. that there has not been a LIVE one in decades… and dump me and complain to others who either agree with them or hold their tongues. .  that was in response to …I am trying to stay out of the controversy, but if you click HERE to the CDC website and look up LIVE MMR VACCINE..

        you may find out that it is a LIVE vaccine..

        and that “mercury was removed from all vaccines”.   yes the typical child ones, replaced by fluoride (even worse) and put into the ANNUAL flu vaxx..   now “recommended for infants 6 months old and everyone yearly.. . )  and so on……

        follow the money and LEARN the truth.. it ain’t taught in the USA med schools..

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